Combat Demo Beta Release
- Thread starter Kieran
- Start date
Crayfish
Insider
My experience with the game leads me to believe that giving hints for a good next combat move would be impossible in Sui Generis. The reason for this is that timing is absolutely critical. The perfect move to make in a particular circumstance could be a disastrous move if you're a fraction of a second off your timing or a few pixels away from the ideal position.
lvk
Insider
@snagar To expand on what @Crayfish mentioned, this only works well in games where the combat is scripted to a degree. Due to the heavily physics-driven nature of Sui Generis' combat system, and due to the core design principle that you fight in tandem with the physics, everything really depends on what the player wants to input. You can still do a right-to-left swing quickly followed by an overhead by your own accord, but the game can't help you with it.
JoshWaldron
Insider
Having slogged through two days of growing pains with the Beta, far and away the most rewarding experience has been slowly figuring out and discovering the mechanics; not of the game, but of fighting with realistic weapons that have weight. When I first found out through experimenting that I could position the mouse to the right of my opponent and it would cause my character to basically take a side-face stand putting my shield between my opponent and I, I was excited. When I learned I could combine that stance with a quick side step while swinging across my body to gain momentum I was elated. If you watched a timelapse video of my character from beginning to now, it would probably look like a very real person learning swordplay for the first time, going from clumsily waving a sword at their opponent to developing a real cadence.
In an industry where simplified, arcade and often cheap-seeming mechanics prevail, this stuff is precious to gamers.
Is this what happens when a game is not just made by honest gamers, but directed by them as well?
In an industry where simplified, arcade and often cheap-seeming mechanics prevail, this stuff is precious to gamers.
Is this what happens when a game is not just made by honest gamers, but directed by them as well?
Baerke Hinn Gauzki
Insider
Holy fucking crap. I picked up the combat-beta and thought I'd just try a little before sleep at around 01:30ish... What happened was that Ijust spent two hours non-stop with it which felt like no time at all. Lovely, now I'll be tired at work tomorrow. BME, WHAT HAST THOU DONE TO ME.
Thanks guys for your detail explanation. I'm into this game because of the physical mechanism.
I understand that hints might be an issue.
The hints are not the best hit to take but complimentary/acceptable moves you can do with minimal balance loss (by the physical engine). For example:
* You swing from left to right.
* The hint engine will display possibilities of upper/lower body hit as suggested move.
* Gamer decided to do a "kong-fu jump" to hit enemy head instead - Avatar loss balance and trip back.
If gamer would have taken an upper/torso or lower hit, his avatar might not loose his footing and the blow might be better engaged in the physics mechanics.
BUT, I start to believe this is an issue with the BerMettle idea of how combat should take place, and this idea might be good if community will prepare few demo combats for newbies to better understand how to deal with movement and placement to achieve acceptable combat effects.
Thanks guys, and I'm looking forward to hear more from the beta testers.
Cheers
I understand that hints might be an issue.
The hints are not the best hit to take but complimentary/acceptable moves you can do with minimal balance loss (by the physical engine). For example:
* You swing from left to right.
* The hint engine will display possibilities of upper/lower body hit as suggested move.
* Gamer decided to do a "kong-fu jump" to hit enemy head instead - Avatar loss balance and trip back.
If gamer would have taken an upper/torso or lower hit, his avatar might not loose his footing and the blow might be better engaged in the physics mechanics.
BUT, I start to believe this is an issue with the BerMettle idea of how combat should take place, and this idea might be good if community will prepare few demo combats for newbies to better understand how to deal with movement and placement to achieve acceptable combat effects.
Thanks guys, and I'm looking forward to hear more from the beta testers.
Cheers
Murf
Moderator
For a beta i think this is incredible, sure it might be a little tricky now and little new in its mechanics, but I have no doubt that come release day this game will be user friendly to those who wish to put just a little bit of time int learning it, I think it will be less of a learning curve than it is now.
WoodlandNinja
Insider
This demo is incredible.
While the characters do move about awkwardly at moments, and the controls are a bit 90 degree learning, the effort is worth it.
Every single hit feels real. Every time i miss, i dread the consequence.
The AI is really amazing. After many many matches, you get the sense of their weaknesses, yet if your not careful, even a full geared character can still be beat with a man and his club. This is golden.
Thanks Bare Mettle. Keep it up and stick to your mandate. We will keep waiting for something if it keeps showing this kind of promise.
While the characters do move about awkwardly at moments, and the controls are a bit 90 degree learning, the effort is worth it.
Every single hit feels real. Every time i miss, i dread the consequence.
The AI is really amazing. After many many matches, you get the sense of their weaknesses, yet if your not careful, even a full geared character can still be beat with a man and his club. This is golden.
Thanks Bare Mettle. Keep it up and stick to your mandate. We will keep waiting for something if it keeps showing this kind of promise.
Cheesecutter
Member
I cant get a login on the download link. It says my email doesn't exist. I've just checked my kickstarter account and I am indeed a backer at the 20 pound level so I should be able to login and download this, right ?
Check THIS thread. You can try the 'forgot password' option or contact BM to resolve your issue. They resolved mine
Cheesecutter
Member
Yep, tried that, it says my account does not exist. I've sent Brendan a message about it .Check THIS thread. You can try the 'forgot password' option or contact BM to resolve your issue. They resolved mine
When you start a conversation with someone, is that the same as a pm ?
Yes, I believe so.
I'm a tad late to the party but I thought I'd add my thoughts to the pile.
As it stands right now I love the direction the devs are taking the game. There's so much potential in this and I can't wait to see more. The demo has also been rock solid stability wise for me. Though I do have few observations that I thought were worth mentioning.
Firstly the weapon weights seem odd, at least for the swords. Now i'm no swordfighter but I've held quite a few in my time and they tend to range from ~4lbs for sabers, short sword, long sword, etc to ~8lbs for larger two handed weapons. Right now it seems like they are a lot heavier and as a result their attacks are these slow swings that have the character over extending during attacks. Now I could see this being the case in something like platemail or something that limits mobility but seeing a guy in a shirt swing like that seems really odd. It's also be nice to have the character at a bit more of a ready stance. The sword and shield are a fighter's tools and they belong up in front of them, not at their sides.
Next up, the character seems to take a long time to turn around, it's the proper time for someone just casually standing there but you would expect someone in combat to be a bit more expedient.
Additionally, there's not a lot of feedback when you make contact with a soft squishy part of a person. Even something as simple as a blood stain on the ground would work. Sure, it doesn't make a ton of sense for a puddle of blood to suddenly appear but it gives some lasting visual reference for the player that they made a hit and it wasn't blocked by armor.
I also agree with one of the other posters that having a visual cue for your strike would be nice. Now given how dynamic the combat it this is understandably difficult. If it were possible to add something indicating the arc the seeing will take though would be nice even if it's just an approximation. Maybe just a transparent plane that follows the orientation of the character's strong elbow (right hand in the player's case) when they go to swing. In addition to this I would just love a 3D mouse cursor. Right now it's difficult to tell where you're telling the character to swing, and I feel like having a cursor inside the game world would make where you're swinging a lot more intuitive.
Lastly just a little bit more zoom would be nice. I read one of the other threads about looking for your opponent's tells and it's totally true. Having just a little bit more zoom would help in this regard. PLus it allows us to marvel at the game's beauty
aaaaand that's it. Everything else seems amazing and I can't wait to see the game grow. You guys are building something really unique here and I love it.
As it stands right now I love the direction the devs are taking the game. There's so much potential in this and I can't wait to see more. The demo has also been rock solid stability wise for me. Though I do have few observations that I thought were worth mentioning.
Firstly the weapon weights seem odd, at least for the swords. Now i'm no swordfighter but I've held quite a few in my time and they tend to range from ~4lbs for sabers, short sword, long sword, etc to ~8lbs for larger two handed weapons. Right now it seems like they are a lot heavier and as a result their attacks are these slow swings that have the character over extending during attacks. Now I could see this being the case in something like platemail or something that limits mobility but seeing a guy in a shirt swing like that seems really odd. It's also be nice to have the character at a bit more of a ready stance. The sword and shield are a fighter's tools and they belong up in front of them, not at their sides.
Next up, the character seems to take a long time to turn around, it's the proper time for someone just casually standing there but you would expect someone in combat to be a bit more expedient.
Additionally, there's not a lot of feedback when you make contact with a soft squishy part of a person. Even something as simple as a blood stain on the ground would work. Sure, it doesn't make a ton of sense for a puddle of blood to suddenly appear but it gives some lasting visual reference for the player that they made a hit and it wasn't blocked by armor.
I also agree with one of the other posters that having a visual cue for your strike would be nice. Now given how dynamic the combat it this is understandably difficult. If it were possible to add something indicating the arc the seeing will take though would be nice even if it's just an approximation. Maybe just a transparent plane that follows the orientation of the character's strong elbow (right hand in the player's case) when they go to swing. In addition to this I would just love a 3D mouse cursor. Right now it's difficult to tell where you're telling the character to swing, and I feel like having a cursor inside the game world would make where you're swinging a lot more intuitive.
Lastly just a little bit more zoom would be nice. I read one of the other threads about looking for your opponent's tells and it's totally true. Having just a little bit more zoom would help in this regard. PLus it allows us to marvel at the game's beauty
aaaaand that's it. Everything else seems amazing and I can't wait to see the game grow. You guys are building something really unique here and I love it.
