Exanima - 5 hours in

5 hours may not seem like much, but it's enough for me to start seeing potential issues (not that there are many of those)

If Exanima is striving to go stand-alone (while completing its original goal to further SG) one thing that will be required is the ability to save ones progress, not a checkpoint, an actual "Save". I'm sure its been requested (and hated on) before but as other people on the forums have said "I don't want to spend the entire campaign mapping and avoiding enemies" it simply doesn't make for a very fun experience.

Saves could come at a price, or simply by limiting the number of times one can do so per campaign (I.e. you can only save 3 total times across a playthrough) I'm all for the brutal difficulty, but the appeal of hardcore gameplay got old back when diablo 2/3 lagspikes could end a hardcore character then and there, it certainly doesn't appeal to to me in a single player game.

Even if it were something cliched such as Softcore/Hardcore modes, in which Hardcore were more rewarding to play, it really doesn't detract from the game in any way by being able to save =/, the difficulty is still there, and loading 50 times doesn't mean you wont die 50 times to the same enemy.

The only other issue I've had is with the general movement in and out of combat, like walking through a door and having my torch hand snag it like a fishhook? Something tells me my wrist would be broken lol, my arm dont bend dat way.

In combat often times I feel like a drunken monkey stumbling around after doing some shots, I could see (Random Villager A) fresh with amnesia having trouble with his footing/swings but it continues further into the game, so perhaps a procedural system that 'steadies' you the more you perform that action? so the more you move around and fight the steadier your legs become (muscles?) and the more you swing a weapon the greater your control, and the less the weapon drags you around once swung? It would be a really cool automatic "Skill" system that completely caters to a persons preferred play style, and even enemies could develop unique skill sets, and become more difficult the longer a fight drags on (especially if you had to run and come back later)

All in all I enjoy this game immensely (even when in novice fight 1 Arena (Random Villager B) rope-a-dopes me lol, a save feature would make me play this game none-stop, even if the idea has been rejected before, please consider it in some form or another?
 

zhuliks

Insider
I myself hate it when I dont have a choice. Its nice that they let us choose early checkpoints in menu, but ability to adjust difficulty, which would include save complexity would be great. People who prefer hardcore, can chose "ironman" mode, people who are save junkies like me, could save after each killed enemy and each setup trap. Everyone is happy that way, yay!

Its especially ironic in a game that potentially has much freedom, it should apply to gameplay settings too.
I only assume its done to force people to retry and play with different character body builds.

As for drunken animations, true characters move like drunks, not following physics sometimes as center of balance shifts too much to the side without their feet supporting the body in time. There are 2 things about that, 1st it looks like only body is physics based, while legs and arms act more like ropes, hanging off it, animated so that it looks almost natural, I assume its done to simplify the calculations in already complex system. Thy have spent 2 years polishing animations (without hiring a separate animator strangely), it became better, but still final product would look more like puppet fight I suspect. Which brings us to the 2nd part - freedom, its a game that gives you a lot of it with your movement and like any game that lets players play with things, things will look ridiculous at some point, but I prefer it this way, better have a chance to make it silly rather than restrain players to strict conditions.

Will all that said most important to remember its new. Its a prototype, that has never been done before, it will look raw however long it is polished, but its still fun and I'm looking forward for it to set an example for others.
Good example is ragdoll technology, its not perfect, it results in silly dead body positions, but its still better than static death animations. It was even hated when ragdoll first appeared in public, now a lot of game screenshots shared are just funny poses of enemy ragdolls.
 
Yeah I agree, it's hard to keep a straight face when fighting after my char cartwheels over a crate and a hobo with a plank goes to town on my prone body XD, the AI's in the arena seem to have their own personas to a degree as well, Novice 1, for instance I call "Random Villager B" and novice 2 is "Fat Man Bob", 3 is "Handyman Stu", it turns into a grudge match after a few rounds LOL. I also really love how it doesn't feel like some scripted battle against a plain AI, they'll exploit your wide swings and missteps.
 

Vold

Insider
From what I understand, save/load mechanism will not be implemented, ever. It's not something to take lightly, and not about giving the players options, but something extremly important for the game and one of the core concepts of game design for the developers.
 
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zhuliks

Insider
From what I understand, save/load mechanism will not be implemented, ever. It's not something to take lightly, and not about giving the players options, but something extremly important for the game and one of the core concepts of game design for the developers.
Its a bit weird though, in every dungeon crawler there is this hardcore 1 life system, so some people just back up saves and then replace them, they are shunned upon, but it works and people do it. Nevertheless developers never put a convenient "cowards mode" or something like that as if they dont want to acknowledge such "cheating" exists.

It works in Exanima too - every time you exit the game it makes a save you can back up. So not making it an option in a menu is a bit arrogant - yes its there, but we dont talk about it.
 

Baka-sama

Member
From what I understand, save/load mechanism will not be implemented, ever. It's not something to take lightly, and not about giving the players options, but something extremly important for the game and one of the core concepts of game design for the developers.
Does that include Sui Generis or is that just Exanima?
 

Vold

Insider
Does that include Sui Generis or is that just Exanima?
SG won't have a save/load system either, afaik.
SG will not have perma-death (maybe as an alternative perma death mode - playing as non-thaumaturge). Upon death, your corpse and everything on it (equipment, backpack,...), will stay in the place of your death. The character will revive in a different body (same or different shape, not sure), somewhere in the map. It will have important consequenses (NPCs that witnessed your death, will think you are a freak or a god, or whatever is their behaviour/personality). You will be able to track down your body and get your stuff back, unless that some NPC decided to loot your body first, and in that case you will have to track him down to get your stuff back.
 
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Baka-sama

Member
SG won't have a save/load system either, afaik.
That's unfortunate, I'm one of those people who likes to create a ton of games at once and use a different style to play through each one. SG still sounds like it will one of the best games around, even without multiple saves.
 

zhuliks

Insider
SG won't have a save/load system either, afaik.
SG will not have perma-death (maybe as an alternative perma death mode - playing as non-thaumaturge). Upon death, your corpse and everything on it (equipment, backpack,...), will stay in the place of your death. The character will revive in a different body (same or different shape, not sure), somewhere in the map. It will have important consequenses (NPCs that witnessed your death, will think you are a freak or a god, or whatever is their behaviour/personality). You will be able to track down your body and get your stuff back, unless that some NPC decided to loot your body first, and in that case you will have to track him down to get your stuff back.
That sounds much better than just "no save option".
 

Elaxter

Insider
In Dark Souls, there are no saves. There's only your character. The game saves automatically basically with every step. Sui Generis could do the same.

"No saves" to me just means you can't save and then reload at that point you saved at. It makes the game easy. I can't tell you how many times I've saved the game in Skyrim and played a part over and over until I got it right. After doing this a lot, it cheapens the experience.
 

Nomad

Member
Yeah I agree, it's hard to keep a straight face when fighting after my char cartwheels over a crate and a hobo with a plank goes to town on my prone body XD, the AI's in the arena seem to have their own personas to a degree as well, Novice 1, for instance I call "Random Villager B" and novice 2 is "Fat Man Bob", 3 is "Handyman Stu", it turns into a grudge match after a few rounds LOL. I also really love how it doesn't feel like some scripted battle against a plain AI, they'll exploit your wide swings and missteps.
The physics makes this game come alive in a way other games don't. I love it when something cool/funny happens because of it.
 
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