Being Drunk

[fluffydino2000]

I must clearly state, I do not think the characters look drunk while fighting. However, the viewpoint did raise a particular thought in my mind. Will drunkenness be in the game?

I think it could be a great dynamic - offer someone a drink, get them talking, then mug 'em outside when they tell you that they've got gold coins stashed in their shoe. The fight would be in your favour 'cause your enemy is stumbling around with his fists.

Discuss!

 

[sunburnedpenguin]

Drunkenness should also open up new dialogue possibilities, perhaps raise one's perceived charisma (or the Sui Generis equivalent) to intoxicated NPCs.

 

[Rob]

Drunkenness as a gameplay mechanic might be ok, providing it's done in a unique way. Other games have done it - Witcher comes to mind immediately - and there's no point reinventing the wheel.

If it's going to be done, it'll have to be very well thought out, so that it's useful/fun and most importantly relevant to the game. Otherwise, it's better leaving it out.

 

[Tony]

...and there's no point reinventing the wheel...

This reminded me of a memorable tweet that Bare Mettle made to someone on Twitter. They were told "there's no point in reinventing the wheel" to which they responded with something along the lines of "there is if the wheel is square!".

 

[unwoundpath]

With the way combat works, you could have people have a delayed reaction to attacks while drunk. If it is you that are drunk, the input would be a little delayed, to simulate that delayed reaction time.

This, of course, would be on top of it being less effective and you stumbling around!

 

[SlippedUp]

If it's going to be done, it'll have to be very well thought out, so that it's useful/fun and most importantly relevant to the game. Otherwise, it's better leaving it out.

I was under the impression that what BM were trying to do here was a make a truly open world. As they put it the current formula of most RPG's follows this line of reasoning;

1) Help the distressed peasant now
2) Help the distressed peasant later
3) Help the distressed peasant reluctantly

this isn't what they want apparently. If this is the case why does drunkenness have to be relevant? In most cases it often isn't. shouldn't it just be there as a mechanic to use if the mood takes you. If you end up dead and/or penniless that's tough. Or am i taking the idea of an open world too far?

 

[Wakko]

If it's going to be done, it'll have to be very well thought out, so that it's useful/fun and most importantly relevant to the game. Otherwise, it's better leaving it out.

Its fine with me if its just a fun mechanic, something silly you can do that adds fun elements into the game. It doesnt have to be useful.

But maybe you mean something like, being at a tavern and drinking with a buddy to get information? Or something like that?

 

[Wakko]

this isn't what they want apparently. If this is the case why does drunkenness have to be relevant? In most cases it often isn't. shouldn't it just be there as a mechanic to use if the mood takes you. If you end up dead and/or penniless that's tough. Or am i taking the idea of an open world too far?

Thats what I thought.

I dont know how hard it would be to create a "truly" open world, would it be too ambitious? I mean, BM seem to have a truly wonderful dev team, making that amazing engine, the beautiful textures and world. I hope they manage to take the sandbox genre to a new level. Where you can do basically what you want. As that is a game I'd like to make and play myself. But as I said, I have no idea how practically make one or how hard it actually would be, if its too ambitious.

I wish for a game where you start out with basically nothing, and end up with something you may or may not created yourself. I've always wished to be able to start my own thieves faction/bandit faction. Not some crap from Skyrim when you join and 10 missions later you're the head boss and gather 1000 gold each week. But something you make the rules for, you send out people on missions.

Well this got off topic, I apologize for that lol.

 

[SlippedUp]

I'm right with you

openness in pen and paper RPG's is wonderfully simply because you are only limited to the players and DM's imagination. Trying to script it for a game is an other matter entirely. trying to code all the possible causes and effects that would entail if you went through the entire game blind drunk would be a game in itself I would imagine.

I wish for a game where you start out with basically nothing, and end up with something you may or may not created yourself. I've always wished to be able to start my own thieves faction/bandit faction. Not some crap from Skyrim when you join and 10 missions later you're the head boss and gather 1000 gold each week. But something you make the rules for, you send out people on missions.

To that I have a possible answer. Dwarf Fortress. I shudder just thinking about all the different facets of that game. Too many to go into here but if you find the time I would definitely recommend checking it out. what it lacks in "pretty graphics" it more than makes up for with sheer possibilities. Bit off topic. Apologies.

I agree that a truly open world may be a little bit on the extreme side but judging from some of the writing they have released on KS I think taverns and thus Drinking will definitely make an appearance.

fingers crossed anyway. I want to take on porky with nothing but a mug of ale clutched in my hands. ^^

 

[Rob]

If it's going to be done, it'll have to be very well thought out, so that it's useful/fun and most importantly relevant to the game. Otherwise, it's better leaving it out.

Its fine with me if its just a fun mechanic, something silly you can do that adds fun elements into the game. It doesnt have to be useful.

But maybe you mean something like, being at a tavern and drinking with a buddy to get information? Or something like that?

Hey, I don't disagree with you guys!!!

By "relevant to the game", I didn't mean necessarily that is has to be "useful", or built into the storyline, etc.

Rather, I just meant that if it is implemented, they'll have to be careful to make sure that it doesn't feel like it's just been put in as an unnecessary add-on as an afterthought, for the sake of it, like a mini-game. That would be an immersion-breaker. Ultimately, if it is put into the game then it should feel natural in it's place, like it fits in well with the overall theme of the game... which is realism and immersion. However, to comply with this doesn't mean you can't have fun!!!

For example, in the Witcher you got drunk on various occasions. Arguably, there were two states: intoxicated and sober. That's not really realistic. When intoxicated, you moved ridiculously slowly, in a very deterministic manner. That's not really realistic. I'll let the Witcher off, since that was innovation back in 2007. However, to repeat similar-fashioned mechanics in 2014's Sui Generis would be a fail.

Perhaps a more realistic implementation of drunkenness might be:

• gradual affect of drinking alcohol - drinking more than some predefined amount (a few pints?) affects movement, slightly, using physics (e.g. top-heavy centre of mass to put you off balance, add stochastic elements to make you wobble), with increased effect stacking as you drink more and more, until becoming paralytic if you force your character to drink more and more. Eventually they might be sick and pass out.
• Drinking alcohol affects the way people see you - for example, other drinkers might see you more favourably, whilst some religious people or teetotallers might treat you with disdain.
• Drinking alcohol affects the way you interact with other people. Drinking a relatively small amount might relax you, make you more charismatic, and generally have a positive affect on people. However, drinking too much might overly reduce your inhibitions, make you incapable of coming across well, and generally have a negative affect on people. This should be on a gradual scale.
• Drinking more and more, on a regular basis, should naturally increase your tolerance to alcohol. This will change the gradient of the affects I describe above. Raising your tolerance might make you able to stay coherent, whilst cunningly getting information out of someone you wanted to question, who you decided to get drunk to loosen their tongue. Also, increased tolerance would help you to stand more chance of winning any drinking competitions that you may become involved in.

But that's just a few ideas. Basically, by "relevant to the game", I meant "thought out well and comprehensively".

 

[SlippedUp]

Basically, by "relevant to the game", I meant "thought out well and comprehensively".

Exactly. That more than anything is important I think. Nothing destroys immersion for me more than a last minute idea implemented poorly.

I like the drunk system you suggested as well. Gaining a tolerance to alcohol so that you can then lull people into a false sense of security would be superb.

[Insert Evil Laughter Here]

 

[Wakko]

To that I have a possible answer. Dwarf Fortress. I shudder just thinking about all the different facets of that game. Too many to go into here but if you find the time I would definitely recommend checking it out. what it lacks in "pretty graphics" it more than makes up for with sheer possibilities. Bit off topic. Apologies.

Dwarf fortress is awesome.

I see what Rob was trying to say now, and I agree with him!

 

[Wakko]

Exactly. That more than anything is important I think. Nothing destroys immersion for me more than a last minute idea implemented poorly.

I like the drunk system you suggested as well. Gaining a tolerance to alcohol so that you can then lull people into a false sense of security would be superb.

[Insert Evil Laughter Here]

Lure them into a alley and rob them.. Mowahahaa!

 

[Tony]

Lure them into a alley and rob them.. Mowahahaa!

What kind of wakkos are on this forum?!

 

[Wakko]

What kind of wakkos are on this forum?!

The one who likes to play stealth characters

 

[Mimel]

I think Rob is right. Drunkenness can easily be adapted. It is just one way to interact with NPCs. I've been pput off of going into the taverns in games. In many of the tabletop games I've played that is the first place you go to in a town. It is where you get the gossip, rest, eat, and meet people. I hope that they have a lively pub scene that is not just the same routine of watching NPCs staring at the table or at each other. I prefer to have lively conversations....maybe on pub is too loud to hear everything, another is quiet and afraid for some reason. All of this can be affected by being drunk or getting someone drunk.

The more I drink, the harder it is for me to understand what is said or what is happening to me. The more they drink the same. All of those factors that Rob listed, excellent. Yes, this is realism. Maybe I'm a dreamer for wanting this, but I think the DEVs are dreamers too.