RE: Madoc's request about the journal

[bobchaos]

In the latest patch post, Madoc asked what we thought about having some automatic entries added to the journal, so I figured I'd get the ball rolling with this thread.

I've got mixed feelings personally. On the one hand, automatic entries would help clarify certain things. On the other, having things be unclear is part of the fun for me. Having so much left to speculation allows the imagination to fill in the gaps.

On my first playthrough I wrote extensively in my journal and adopted a first person narrative style. It's become so huge I could probably publish the damn thing as a novel XD I guess I would have to lean towards keeping the journal as is because of that, pre-set entries would have ruined my personal narrative.

I suspect we can divide the player base in 3: those like me, those who care about the journal but are too lazy/mesmerized by the game to write in it, and those who still haven't noticed there's a journal cuz there's stuff to smash XD Our real answer probably lies with which one of the first 2 groups is more dominant in this community.

Alternatively, these pre-set journal entries could be made optional. Maybe have a "full RP mode" button on the start screen that disables any "automated first-person storytelling" like this or (eventually) the player's character talking to himself or commenting on stuff.

Anyhow... thoughts? comments? suggestions? violent reactions? all at once?! *hides*

 

[Jennre_Bard]

In the latest patch post, Madoc asked what we thought about having some automatic entries added to the journal, so I figured I'd get the ball rolling with this thread.

I've got mixed feelings personally. On the one hand, automatic entries would help clarify certain things. On the other, having things be unclear is part of the fun for me. Having so much left to speculation allows the imagination to fill in the gaps.

On my first playthrough I wrote extensively in my journal and adopted a first person narrative style. It's become so huge I could probably publish the damn thing as a novel XD I guess I would have to lean towards keeping the journal as is because of that, pre-set entries would have ruined my personal narrative.

I suspect we can divide the player base in 3: those like me, those who care about the journal but are too lazy/mesmerized by the game to write in it, and those who still haven't noticed there's a journal cuz there's stuff to smash XD Our real answer probably lies with which one of the first 2 groups is more dominant in this community.

Alternatively, these pre-set journal entries could be made optional. Maybe have a "full RP mode" button on the start screen that disables any "automated first-person storytelling" like this or (eventually) the player's character talking to himself or commenting on stuff.

Anyhow... thoughts? comments? suggestions? violent reactions? all at once?! *hides*

I think the journal should only add the date automatically. The rest of the entries should be left to the player in my opinion.

Jenn BRD

 

[Syllabear3]

The journal only exists for roleplayers. Normal people only care about cutting moving things.
If they add a preset journal should be absolutly optional.

 

[bobchaos]

The journal only exists for roleplayers. Normal people only care about cutting moving things.
If they add a preset journal should be absolutly optional.

If they add a preset journal, you wouldn't know because you're too busy ignoring the role playing aspect of the role playing game you bought

 

[Syllabear3]

If they add a preset journal, you wouldn't know because you're too busy ignoring the role playing aspect of the role playing game you bought

You can roleplay with anything, the combat system is what make this game unique, not the roleplaying. Thats why the complete game will be called "sui generis" (unique of its kind, latin).

 

[Jennre_Bard]

The combat is excellent, without a doubt. From everything I have read about Exanima and SG, it is an RPG with excellent combat. If they focus on the story/dialogue/etc as much as they have the combat system, Exanima AND Sui Generis will be outstanding RPGs. As an avid fan of the ARPG genre, I can honestly say you cannot roleplay with anything if the story sucks, is too linear, or just plain cliche. If the characters are cookie cutter, if the NPCs are lifeless, roleplaying is simply hollow and unsatisfying.

So far, the Combat is awesome, the puzzles are awesome, the NPCs feel alive (and that is without dialogue!). I am pretty sure I read somewhere that dialogue will be robust, NPCs will have their own schedules and agenda, your character isnt the center of the universe, and there is an indication of ecology (since everything will have a purpose for existing).

The world turns without you but your decisions will shape the world around you (or not). That alone tells me that there will be a relatively large and complex story/dialogue system, society, politics, grey lines between right and wrong, etc. All of these things are elements of a quality RPG. Think about this, if the intent is to focus only on combat, why would the developer encourage people attempt to solve problems without combat instead of just killing everything that moves?

These features seem amazing to me and I can't wait until the Story mode is complete. This game is the first game in a LONG time that "FEELS" like Ultima/Ultima Underworld, which is a very hard thing to do.

Oh, and as far as "Normal people only care about cutting moving things. If they add a preset journal should be absolutly optional."

It would be, for "normal people like you" simply don't press "J". hahahaha

I know everyone that plays this game probably has slightly different reasons and features that they love, however, if you only see this as a combat game, I am willing to bet you will be cheating yourself out of an amazing experience

Jenn BRD

 

[Jennre_Bard]

All of that said, I wish they would implement bard/skald/musician Player Characters in some way, though *sigh*

Jenn

 

[CandleStickZombie]

I love role playing but as far as examine goes there is not much to so for me at least. There is no one to talk to and If I or a character where thrown into this situation they would react the way I did. I got scared, lost and frustrated. I didn't have time to stop and write. after I got better at fighting, the way I solved the first 4 levels was just by hunting down everything that moved and killing it. I keep scrolls to find the story and clues. The only thing I wish I used the journal for is to keep a kill count.

Other than that I like the option of the journal to free write but I don't personally use it. I would like an automatic kill count and a clue log with some sort of timeline.

 

[Syllabear3]

Reading is boring and tiring... the only time i enjoyed reading was when i discovered "The Lord of the Rings" and "Harry Potter" (after the second or third it started to get somehow boring).
I personally would rp if there is people around, but this is single player and i wouldnt like to rol with an ai, for me makes no sense. Even if it is outstanding ai, it feels lifeless no matter what, you know that they dont feel.

I think most of the people in here are interested in combat, because is the best combat system so far.
Is like if you go to an ice cream shop for a coffe. It happens, but more people will buy ice cream than a coffe. It's the same here, it doesn't matter how good the "story/dialogue system, society, politics"... combat is the best this game has to offer. Other stuff will be completly secondary for me.
And as long as it doesn't prevent me to access all the content, i don't see why not add so much rp stuffies. For example to own "the magical butt ring", that only the king possesses, you need to rp (or read a lot of text and give proper answers) a lot to reach the king. Instead i would like just kill all the guards and cut in half the king and pick up the magical butt ring.

 

[bobchaos]

Reading is boring and tiring...

Well, that explains a lot I think I'm going to open another thread and post my own journal in it, it should demonstrate the RP potential of a game with no dialogue. I'll do that when I get back from work and link to it here.

Sure, the combat is revolutionary and awesome in so many ways, but if you think all RP concerns are secondary then you'll be very disappointed with SG and Exanima's story mode.

 

[Scarecrow]

I'm personally all for automatic journal entries but they shouldn't in any way impose a personality on the player character by the way it is written, so that it doesn't conflict with the way I see him. Keep it strictly "need-to-know" hard facts. Kind of like hurriedly scribbled notes.

 

[bobchaos]

Here's the thread with my journal: http://www.baremettle.com/forums/index.php?threads/journal-of-an-adventurer.6323/ Might wanna get a drink and some snacks before you start reading

 

[Syllabear3]

Well, that explains a lot I think I'm going to open another thread and post my own journal in it, it should demonstrate the RP potential of a game with no dialogue. I'll do that when I get back from work and link to it here.

Sure, the combat is revolutionary and awesome in so many ways, but if you think all RP concerns are secondary then you'll be very disappointed with SG and Exanima's story mode.

I don't think if you understood what i meant with "secondary". It doesnt mean that if i like the combat i wont enjoy the story. I played "pillars of eternity", even if i liked the story, i enjoyed the combat MORE.

 

[Tyon]

It'd be interesting to see, and could help out more novice players by giving subtle hints. I think it should be an option though.

 

[bobchaos]

I played some Long Dark yesterday and noticed they added an auto-journal of their own. It's not quite as "offensive" as I would have thought, and a similar system could have it's place alongside the existing journal mechanics we have.

It just says simple, factual stuff like Scarecrow suggested. Day 1: Got bit by a wolf, bleeding wound, bandaged the wound, caught an infection, made it to the next morning. Day 2: Took some meds. Infection went away. Condition fully restored. Caught hypothermia etc...

In exanima it might be more Area 1: Engaged an opponent in combat, got a cut to the arm, defeated opponent or opponent broke combat and ran, equipped a new weapon, etc... I would just want it to avoid naming things that the player's character could not name. "Killed Sir" would break immersion ("killed monstrous creature" would be better), for instance, or "entered Bob's bedroom". How would you know the room belonged to Bob as you enter it unless his name is carved on the door? On the other hand, the tavern on lvl2 is clearly and without a doubt, well, a tavern, so it would be OK to have the journal say "Entered the tavern".

If anything, it just helps build your own narrative as you can reference those notes in your "freestyle" journal as long as everything is kept factual from your character's perspective. That said I'd still prefer if even this was optional, or perhaps kept in a separate window you can pull alongside the journal (or not if you prefer to ignore it)

 

[konggary]

Off-topic I know, but this peeved me for some reason.

Spoiler

You can roleplay with anything, the combat system is what make this game unique, not the roleplaying. Thats why the complete game will be called "sui generis" (unique of its kind, latin).

It's called "Sui Generis" because the character is unique. The character in SG is able to come back to life after dying. Sure the uniqueness can apply to the game itself, but I think that's inadvertent.

 

[Syllabear3]

Off-topic I know, but this peeved me for some reason.

Spoiler

It's called "Sui Generis" because the character is unique. The character in SG is able to come back to life after dying. Sure the uniqueness can apply to the game itself, but I think that's inadvertent.

Spoiler

 

[Jennre_Bard]

For example to own "the magical butt ring", that only the king possesses, you need to rp (or read a lot of text and give proper answers) a lot to reach the king. Instead i would like just kill all the guards and cut in half the king and pick up the magical butt ring.

And then have to kill the entire village after having killed their king, including the only guy that has gotten past the traps in the "dungeon of freeing the entire world from darkness" with the final room requiring that you recite an incantation, an incantation known only by the last sole survivor of that expedition, who became king when they had to perform that ritual, killed by you so you can get that ring of butt slaying. =P

Jenn BRD

 

[Jennre_Bard]

I played some Long Dark yesterday and noticed they added an auto-journal of their own. It's not quite as "offensive" as I would have thought, and a similar system could have it's place alongside the existing journal mechanics we have.

Tell me more of this "Long Dark" you speak of... A quick google search didn't show me a demo. If there is one,I would like to give it a playthrough.

 

[Jennre_Bard]

I found it, early access. Hrmm. I am more into the fantasy genre, but I love good story and puzzles. Bob, is it worth the 20 bucks?

Jenn