Some fun and realistic game mechanics that can me made

[Siggi]

I assume you guys have done research on medieval period armor and weaponary and such. But I think you could really take advantage of some stuff to make the choices you make alot more risk vs reward than it already is, which opens up alot of options on how to play.
These may be way too clunky or tedious, but its just some ideas.

Helmets with adjustable visors and breaths.

When you are wearing heavy armor at the moment, the only penalty is moving slower. But what about helmets? There are no current penalty for what would be the reduced vision in enclosed helmets. Or the limited ability to breathe that comes with a helmet like this.
What the idea is, is that when your visor is down your vison is limited to only what is in front of you expanding in a V-shape, everything else is black. And with a keybind you can open it to assess the situation, but risking a blow to the face. And while it is open you get some air too, and this could work with the stamina bar, letting it refill faster. Helmets that are open would have neither of these penalties.


Carrying weapons in hand, sheath and on belt.

How about having a fast way to access your weapons in a fight. I dont know if you guys are going to include weapon dropping, but I think it would be usefull nonetheless. Sword not the suitable weapon for the situation? Good that your belt has a buckle slot for a hammer that you can access with a keybind. But having 2 swords, hammer, dagger and a quiver would make it easier to tangle it on something, etc.

Different fighting modes on weapon

This has probably been talked about before but I think it could really work and not be tedious at all.
Lets say you have a longsword, and you have a keybind to change the mode/style you are using for it currently. For different ways of swinging it or half-swording it to trip the enemy, and all these skills would have to be trained with the skill system of course. And I think this game could really benefit from this seeing as how no game can implement it because they are not physics based. If you guys have studied fencing videos you would see there are alot of movesets that can be made.

Hope this is usefull in some way, Cheers

 

[Hedgehog-of-Fog]

1. IMO this is too crude to shut nice picture of the game and simple grind in this V-shaped sector... BTW this could became a torture in the dark dungeons so why you need a great visored helm if you can't see anything in it?

2. There also could be another useful things on belts - keys (or key-chain), torch (or oil lamp), compass, etc.

3. Huh, first time I saw the name of third chapter, I think about alternate weapon mode alike an axe, which could have slash or blunt damage depending on which side it striking...

 

[MikeHBS]

1- I really like that idea, but I would suggest that instead of pure black on the things you can't see, be like on the game darkwood, so you'll know where an object/wall is so you won't bump on it

3- I want to see this in the game, specially the half-swording part

 

[Siggi]

1. IMO this is too crude to shut nice picture of the game and simple grind in this V-shaped sector... BTW this could became a torture in the dark dungeons so why you need a great visored helm if you can't see anything in it?
2. There also could be another useful things on belts - keys (or key-chain), torch (or oil lamp), compass, etc.
3. Huh, first time I saw the name of third chapter, I think about alternate weapon mode alike an axe, which could have slash or blunt damage depending on which side it striking...

1. English isnt my first language so I was hoping someone would correct me like Mike did below, thanks. That is what I meant. So you could see the room, simulation that one can feel the space around you, but not what moves in it. When you put your visor up you can see perfectly clearly. And it would still protect.

2 I've read the other big thread about scabbards. And my take would be that you can have alot of slots for weapons on your person, provided that you have the scabbard/sheath/buckle attatched to you belt, and you can place weapons there, and then assign a hotkey, so now you can get to it quick without dragging from menu, which is still possible to use, but slower ofc. Compare it to favorite system from skyrim and fallout 4. And yes, what youve suggested would expand on that, nice.

3. Some axes have a pointy side, but that would probably work the way thrusting will, but weapons like halberds that have different things on the blade for different purposes. And the sword can be used in alot of different ways. And I would suggest a skill progression on each weapon (might be too much animation work though) that makes it go from how some weapons swing now. Like a drunk madman to elegant fencing.

 

[oldnorsehero]

I think all three are good ideas, medieval things fascinate me, and it's true that when you don full-plate, including helmet, you sacrifice not only mobility and speed, but breathing and field-of-view. Which means you can't just run, balls out, into a swinging weapon and not care, you have to think and time things correctly while keeping your eyes fixed on the enemy.

I see the scabbard deal like so: the sword is in it's scabbard on it's belt, and you have a torch in your dominant hand and a shield in your off-hand. When you need to fight, press the battle button, our character drops the torch on the floor, unsheathes the blade and is ready to dance. Things like that would be immersive to me.

I honestly think if they added a fencing element in this game, I'd love it. I love swordsmanship, especially fencing. You may know how to sword dance with a medieval sword, but unless you know how to fence, you're missing out on a lot of good techniques. They could pull it off, too. Or when the final game comes out, mods can. This physics-based system can be with any atmosphere, be it medieval, pirate era, etc. Glad someone posting something like this, I was close to hahaha

 

[Orlacktherof]

Maybe with a helmet, the game just gives you a level of tunnel vision to simulate that?

 

[Reiher Allendi]

I know that it's not something that I would consider fun (helmet question) - but there's few things right now in the game that you may not find fun - but these things can create a new kind of experience for the player.

I'd like the idea because this fact can increase your character customization for your kind of gameplay. I don't like the fact that "full plate armor" have only the "encrumbance" penalty. Come on, guys - we have skills to reduce armor penalty - so it's obvious that everyone will prefer to play full geared.

In real life you can see a lot of different armors used because full plate armor real life penalty isn't so simples as weight - even your movements can be restricted.

About the stamina factor - I think it will not work, since stamina in this game is something like "HP". Running or strike blows doesn't affect your stamina (I think we should have some kind of energy bar instead mana).

 

[Hedgehog-of-Fog]

Come on, guys - we have skills to reduce armor penalty - so it's obvious that everyone will prefer to play full geared.

AFAIK, player will be able to max out only 3 branches of skills (BTW what about not maxing out them? is it possible to have 5-6 not maxed branches?), so there will be balance - you could be master in armour/shield/weapon skill, but there will be no other skills for you in this condition (no shooting, no thaumaturgy).

In real life you can see a lot of different armors used because full plate armor real life penalty isn't so simples as weight - even your movements can be restricted.

There's another limit factor of using fullplate by everyone in real life - high cost of it and low resourses of good enough steel (is anybody saw fullplate of lead or copper?)

About the stamina factor - I think it will not work, since stamina in this game is something like "HP". Running or strike blows doesn't affect your stamina (I think we should have some kind of energy bar instead mana).

Nice idea. It is too unrealistic when you could run the whole dungeon in fullplate with 10 points of encumbrance and deal good fight after that.

 

[Reiher Allendi]

AFAIK, player will be able to max out only 3 branches of skills (BTW what about not maxing out them? is it possible to have 5-6 not maxed branches?), so there will be balance - you could be master in armour/shield/weapon skill, but there will be no other skills for you in this condition (no shooting, no thaumaturgy).


There's another limit factor of using fullplate by everyone in real life - high cost of it and low resourses of good enough steel (is anybody saw fullplate of lead or copper?)


Nice idea. It is too unrealistic when you could run the whole dungeon in fullplate with 10 points of encumbrance and deal good fight after that.

I agree with you. The question isn't exactly nerf "heavy armor" - I just want to feel more advantage of not use some specific parts of armor.

 

[Siggi]

I think that the way the health and stamina system is now is hard to work with. I think having something like what UFC Undispudted has is better. A silhouette and a bar

Spoiler

I think it would work better if the current stamina bar can reach the end without passing out, and replenish
continuerly seeing youre not getting hit or swinging your weapon. At zero swinging and walking becomes waggly and uncontrollable.

This is how stamina bar would work.

I dont think cuts should have much to do with stamina.



The silhouette work in the way that the more yellow the body parts get, the less effective they become.
If the head gets intirely yellow you get knocked out.
The arms reduces strenght and speed in swings
Legs makes you walk slower and makes it easier to trip.
Torso would make the stamina bar take a big hit if you get hit here alot.

Cuts instanly makes the body parts stop functioning properly and makes them red. Hard cuts to the face is not survivale, unlike how the game shows it now. Small cuts would just make yellow since it shouldnt have much of a difference.

There could be skills or perks worked into this system. Like if you get bad cuts you get pumped with adrenaline and your stamina is improved greatly.

I dont know if having the silhouette thing might make it really complicated. But the bar is something I really think could improve.

 

[Don Kanaille]

In real life you can see a lot of different armors used because full plate armor real life penalty isn't so simples as weight - even your movements can be restricted.

I have to disagree. In the context of a medieval battlefield, pretty much any close combat fighter would be better off with full plate armor (unless there are some extreme environmental conditions, like knee-deep mud). Well made plate is hardly hindering a trained user while it tremendously increases your survivablity. The only common reason not to use it in a battle is its cost, or if you´re not expected to fight in the melee at all (e.g. if you´re an archer).


Regarding the OP:

1. A neat idea, but I think I have to side with the gameplay-sake side for once here: Exanimas combat would be sickening with only a V-shaped field of view, I fear. Maybe add some other factor...

2. Weapon sheaths: A great idea, which has already been discussed a lot. A quick-swap system is already confirmed, but we don´t know if it will utilize scabbards or not.

3. Weapon stances/grips: Already confirmed. Well be added at some point.

 

[Reiher Allendi]

I have to disagree. In the context of a medieval battlefield, pretty much any close combat fighter would be better off with full plate armor (unless there are some extreme environmental conditions, like knee-deep mud). Well made plate is hardly hindering a trained user while it tremendously increases your survivablity. The only common reason not to use it in a battle is its cost, or if you´re not expected to fight in the melee at all (e.g. if you´re an archer).


Regarding the OP:

1. A neat idea, but I think I have to side with the gameplay-sake side for once here: Exanimas combat would be sickening with only a V-shaped field of view, I fear. Maybe add some other factor...

2. Weapon sheaths: A great idea, which has already been discussed a lot. A quick-swap system is already confirmed, but we don´t know if it will utilize scabbards or not.

3. Weapon stances/grips: Already confirmed. Well be added at some point.

What about "rogues", "assassins"?

 

[konggary]

What about "rogues", "assassins"?

Stealth is planned. Don't expect it to be easy, or to have instakill backstab moves.
Madoc has expressed that he liked the stealth system in the Thief games, based on light, visibility and sound. Plate armor also has a disadvantage here as well: heavy and loud. Oh and I'm pretty sure they plan to include disguises in SG

 

[Reiher Allendi]

Stealth is planned. Don't expect it to be easy, or to have instakill backstab moves.
Madoc has expressed that he liked the stealth system in the Thief games, based on light, visibility and sound. Plate armor also has a disadvantage here as well: heavy and loud. Oh and I'm pretty sure they plan to include disguises in SG

Stealth, thaumaturgy and ranged combat (archer). These things just can't be easy, it would ruin the game. Xlegolasx, Kakashibr and Gandalfthewhite should not agree.

__________________________

(edit: just to not make another post)

I was thinking - ok, I know this game is supposed to be hard and realistic - but I have a question, or idea, that would add more realism and even increase the gameplay complexity (not complicated).

At game beggining I'd prefer to use my torch (with a shield) to kill first enemies. So I figure out - why the torch can't have additional fire damage? Another thing - why I can't light candles (some enemies have it) using torch's fire?

And finally - since there's no save game and almost none potions - why you can't regen your health? Even if it took weeks to get full health is better than nothing.

 

[Hedgehog-of-Fog]

And finally - since there's no save game and almost none potions - why you can't regen your health? Even if it took weeks to get full health is better than nothing.

Maybe you just didn't wait enough... hehehe...

 

[Orlacktherof]

Maybe you just didn't wait enough... hehehe...

*stands idly for weeks on end*
>Fun
>Unnecessary game mechanic

>pick one.

 

[Reiher Allendi]

*stands idly for weeks on end*
>Fun
>Unnecessary game mechanic

>pick one.

Delete your character because you lost 20% hp before first save point:
>Fun
>Unnecessary game mechanic

 

[Hedgehog-of-Fog]

*stands idly for weeks on end*
>Fun
>Unnecessary game mechanic

>pick one.

Delete your character because you lost 20% hp before first save point:
>Fun
>Unnecessary game mechanic

Ah, you my little perfectionist!

 

[Don Kanaille]

What about "rogues", "assassins"?

As I said, if you plan to got to battle, the best armor is always preferable. If you plan on doing other things, then probably not.

The thing is, I don´t see SG/Exanima as a game where "rogues" and "assasins" are a form of combatant. An assassin is someone who is supposed to eleminate a target person, and these things are usually not achieved by busting down the door swords blazing, but by a pillow on the face, a quick thrust with a dagger or a drop of poison. An assassins first goal should be to look unsuspicious, so he would probably wear a peasants or servants clothes. The only time he would wear armor if he would pose as a guard.

Just try to free your mind a bit of RPG clichees where assassins and rogues ar possible classes which spin daggers in someones face, and ask yourself: If you found yourself in a situation where someone swung a blade or a club at you, would you feel more comfortable in cloth and leather with a dagger in your hand or encased in steel with longsword?

 

[Orlacktherof]

Just try to free your mind a bit of RPG clichees where assassins and rogues ar possible classes which spin daggers in someones face, and ask yourself: If you found yourself in a situation where someone swung a blade or a club at you, would you feel more comfortable in cloth and leather with a dagger in your hand or encased in steel with longsword?

This, exactly. Sui Generis will not be linear, or even really have a story to have to follow, not forcing the devs to have to make assassins/rouges "Pick" classes where they do whatever they do in other games.