nrage
Supporter
I cannot bring myself to use crouch in combat. It just feels wrong on so many levels.
The blocking system is broken?
- Thread starter Greeny
- Start date
Nynuc
Insider
Blame this man for my fighting style.
And yes, I agree sheilds are very realistic in the fact they can block just about any oncomming attack. But the problem is, swinging the sword isn't very realistic, or the footwork for that matter, so it kinda offsets a bunch of strategies you could use to overcome the shield. I just think if whoever is attacking with the sheild should be sightly more open to a counter when their attacking.
nrage
Supporter
I can't blame you.
All true. And.. it's gonna be hard for them to to make this game more detailed in those respects without making the controls completely unmanageable.
When attacking with a shield you don't really have to expose yourself, heck you can even keep your striking arm and hand behind the shield and still reach the length of your sword out in front. It's not an aggressive sort of attack, but then even a more aggressive one should not move the shield very far out of the way, just enough to get the striking arm forward a bit more, and into danger. Now, if we could intentionally cut down on the arm..
Rod_Lightning
Insider
I believe Madoc has stated on a stream that crouching was something experimental when they put it in and is not at all properly functioning and optimally integrated in gameplay.
nrage
Supporter
It would be better if the crouch key, in combat, was a toggle for low strikes. Outside combat, sure, just an actual crouch.
tiny lampe
Insider
And it would be even better if attacks were aimable with the crosshair. Thrusts will be, so why not swings too?
nrage
Supporter
Ideally they would. Not sure how technically feasible it is, targeting an overhead strike is already a little difficult due to the camera/isometric view.
puksus
Member
Try to fight with someone in real life. It is clear that when you are able to avoid blocking without losing good position, it is usually better. Because your enemy has to restore himself back to a good position. When you block, it is harder, because YOU most likely also will need to restore. What is more, when you block much, you get lots of vibration from weapon, or your hands get beaten when hand to hand. Also you should understand that a shield in reality can't receive such damage it easily holds in game, and it is not so hard to penetrate or to break the arm that holds a shield.
If you block, it is always risky, so, ability to block every attack is UNrealistic. That's what i like this game for. You can't block everything.
If you block, it is always risky, so, ability to block every attack is UNrealistic. That's what i like this game for. You can't block everything.
Pilluminati
Insider
Be careful, if Elric sees your post you're done for
puksus
Member
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elric_of_MelnibonéBe careful, if Elric sees your post you're done for
Well, if you talk about this Elric, i didn't read this book, or whatever it is, so, i didn't understand you. So, explain please.
I was referencing material i red from the internet about vikings e.t.c from different reconstructor's cites and my own experience, not very large though, with karate.
P.S. Sorry for potential mistakes, english isn't my native language.
nrage
Supporter
@puksus I've done both karate and some medieval reenactment myself so I have some idea where you're coming from.
WRT shields not taking as much damage, sure there is a breaking point but it very much depends on the materials it's made of and the weapons hitting it. If you have a light wooden shield and you block an axe at full power, don't expect it to last long and expect that when it goes you will likely take some damage.
But, that's an extreme example and in addition to different materials and weapons there are techniques that can be used, especially with smaller shields to turn direct blows into glancing ones, or catch the blow on the shaft to stifle it etc. The same is true for blocking with a sword, you don't want to meet the blow head on or you will really feel it and may also damage your weapon, instead you want to deflect and use that motion to start your own counter strike.
Having shield damage in the game would be a neat feature and in addition to character error would mean that sometimes you fail to block, which is as it should be.
WRT shields not taking as much damage, sure there is a breaking point but it very much depends on the materials it's made of and the weapons hitting it. If you have a light wooden shield and you block an axe at full power, don't expect it to last long and expect that when it goes you will likely take some damage.
But, that's an extreme example and in addition to different materials and weapons there are techniques that can be used, especially with smaller shields to turn direct blows into glancing ones, or catch the blow on the shaft to stifle it etc. The same is true for blocking with a sword, you don't want to meet the blow head on or you will really feel it and may also damage your weapon, instead you want to deflect and use that motion to start your own counter strike.
Having shield damage in the game would be a neat feature and in addition to character error would mean that sometimes you fail to block, which is as it should be.
nrage
Supporter
What you should be asking for is a way to use your empty off hand - like for example punching, grappling, pulling the shield out of the way, throwing something at the opponent, and so on, all things that Bron would do
Greeny
Member
Agree with the shield damage idea, it would be nice.
But about blocks. Its OK, if blocking does not work in situations where it is not possible - for example, too strong blow with heavy weapon, or hit in zone, that you physically can't cover with shield or short blade, like feet. And it is fair, if speed of block performing will depend on the character's skill. Or another things like this, when you know exactly what your character is able to.
But character error at blocking in game like Exanima or Sui Generis... In my opinion, it is something like "Sometimes when you want to perfom a dodge, your WASD buttons will not work, because your dodge(athletic/evasion) skill is not high enough".
Last edited:
Hedgehog-of-Fog
Member
I spent last three nights in a row with sword/mace and shield in Exanima. There was no any time when would have occurred some "shield block mistakes". Mostly have been my own faults - wrong steps, wrong timing and "zugzwang" (you may know this from chess).
Downstairs Eddie
Insider
I'm a bit late here, but in response to the OP video, take a look at where your cursor is when you say your block 'failed'. Often your cursor is nowhere near the head of your opponent's weapon. You have to follow your enemy's weapon closely if you want to block it.
That said, Madoc has said that blocking is basically broken at the moment, so we'll see what happens when the skill system is introduced.
That said, Madoc has said that blocking is basically broken at the moment, so we'll see what happens when the skill system is introduced.
Greeny
Member
I did not notice this in game yet. Any proofs if this? I thought blocking depends only on direction in which character is rotated (and I have fulfilled these conditions in most situations in the video).
Murf
Moderator
For general purposes yes, you need to be facing your attacker, for more accurate blocking, you should face the shield at the weapon as it is coming towards you for a more precise block.
Greeny
Member
Yes, I understand that. I mean that, as I think, it is no difference, where is cursor located - on the enemy's weapon or elsewhere near the straight line of his strike (where the first point is shield or weapon of defender and the second point is blade of attacker).
Anthony Obilor
Insider
Guys, for me as a sword and shield player, I face my shield to the character, the cursor is only a means to do that. I play as if I am the character, I don't face him straight on, shield on my side..., I put my shield between me and him, I would say my cursor is to the right on the enemy at that time. Also i use the cursor to rotate and twist my character so I swing my shield arm into position. As a shield player don't use the cursor as a target when blocking, feel your character and use the weight of the shield to get good rotation. Or if you are standing still, make sure you put your shield between him and you.
Also know your enemy's weapon, axes tend to hit you if you block the shaft as the axehead by-passes the shield. It is all about the positioning of your shield, The character actually tries his best to get to the best position to block but if you don't help him out by rotating and giving him bracing space, then expect your blocks to be weak. The blocking is one of my favourite things of the game, it is definitely not perfect and will need alot of work, but the blocking in this game is very similar to human reaction. The way we automatically and instinctually do things, but with experience and training we react better to anticipate blows. The only people that give me real trouble in the arena are sword and shield NPCs (The Ladies with the big shields), sometimes the 2H sword can be a pain, maces can be a pain, but never as hard as sword and shield.
Also know your enemy's weapon, axes tend to hit you if you block the shaft as the axehead by-passes the shield. It is all about the positioning of your shield, The character actually tries his best to get to the best position to block but if you don't help him out by rotating and giving him bracing space, then expect your blocks to be weak. The blocking is one of my favourite things of the game, it is definitely not perfect and will need alot of work, but the blocking in this game is very similar to human reaction. The way we automatically and instinctually do things, but with experience and training we react better to anticipate blows. The only people that give me real trouble in the arena are sword and shield NPCs (The Ladies with the big shields), sometimes the 2H sword can be a pain, maces can be a pain, but never as hard as sword and shield.
