walltar
Insider
I hope there will be also possibility to switch off "here i am" pointer on the map .... i would like to use village names, castles, rivers and dungeons for navigation.
Quests
- Thread starter Oona
- Start date
Verva
Member
I find the idea of NPC's giving you errands kind of dumb. They don't know you, why is the first thing they do upon meeting you is to tell you that they need you to pick up x from y. You should be spending time talking to NPC's, making friends with them. Learning what makes them tick and interacting with them like you're both human beings. They should have personalities, and once you know what they are good at, you can use that to your advantage.
Say you coma across someone and hit up a conversation. In idle chat, you are charismatic and you become her friend. You talk to her again sometime later, and learn that she has a fair knowledge of wild plants and such from years of gardening. You realize that if you have any questions about wild plantlife; what berries you can eat nearby, what plants to avoid, if any have medicinal value, you can talk with her about it at any time. There was no quest, but your interaction yeilded a reward in a realistic manner.
I hope that ^ is how you guys go about "questing", or even find better ways of doing it.
Say you coma across someone and hit up a conversation. In idle chat, you are charismatic and you become her friend. You talk to her again sometime later, and learn that she has a fair knowledge of wild plants and such from years of gardening. You realize that if you have any questions about wild plantlife; what berries you can eat nearby, what plants to avoid, if any have medicinal value, you can talk with her about it at any time. There was no quest, but your interaction yeilded a reward in a realistic manner.
I hope that ^ is how you guys go about "questing", or even find better ways of doing it.
the0thMonkey
Member
While musing about making an RPG for my own enjoyment, I considered this idea. I'm still not sure whether I'm for or against it. On the one hand, it does help immersion and would lead to a greater connection to your quests (unlike almost all the quests in Skyrim where my general game plan was "make it to the marker, do the thing, claim my reward"). On the other hand, what if you miss a detail (assuming asking the NPC about it is not an option). Also, having a nice, official-looking record of the quest is preferable to my own misspelt, uncapitalised, ineloquent writing.
When compared to an automatic quest log, the journal seems ghetto. When compared to having no quest log, it seems really good. I think it depends on what you like and what you're used to.
In this game (because of the realism), I can imagine it working and I think the pros would outweigh the cons if it was implemented well.
TheScythian
Insider
Hehe, that is a good point...although I think that just adds to the charm of the system.
A) it makes conversations meaningful and important to pay attention to, as they would be in real life when listening to instructions/ directions), rather than just ignoring what people are saying and immediately checking some arbitrary quest checklist for where to go.
B) it would make it possible to miss certain things on your first playthrough, or stumble across unexpected places/ treasure if you get lost. And lets face it in an open-ended game with a compelling world getting lost is half the fun.
C) you'd be paying attention to your surroundings much more. One of my favourite elements of Red Dead Redemption was using the treasure maps to find hidden chests, you'd get a sketch of a distinctive rock formation for example and either recognise it as somewhere you had seen or look out for it on your future travels.
Obviously with such a system it would be handy if there was a dialogue option for "Could you repeat that, please?". I can also understand that not everyone wants to be writing their own notes so perhaps the journal could be optional (or maybe I'll just turn off quest log and do it with pen and paper anyway
).The journal would work best with a more naturalistic system like Verva proposed ^ and maybe less so with a more traditional rigid quest system.
The Hedge Knight
Member
I still would prefer some style of journal and hints at where to go. "GO HEAD TO THE CAVE OF EVIL" is annoying when there are three caves of evil and you know where none of them are so you just have to wander.
calithlin
Insider
Here's my rationale for a detailed quest journal: I'm not my character.
I'd like to think I am, and I we sure act the same sometimes, but I'm a person living in another world, with things to remember, deadlines to meet, and names I constantly forget as is.
Our characters in Sui Generis would remember much more than we do as gamers. It's all they do. If they hear Jane Doe can only be saved from an ogre with an enchanted spade, our characters will remember something important like that. However, us as people have other things to worry about, and if we leave the game for a week and return, no time has elapsed for our characters (still rearin' to go and find that enchanted space), but it's not unlikely for us as people to forget the current objective.
The Journal isn't really for our character's purpose, but ours as extensions of that character. Adventurer Dan knows his current task backwards and forwards, so the journal is there to remind us of what we already know.
I'd like to think I am, and I we sure act the same sometimes, but I'm a person living in another world, with things to remember, deadlines to meet, and names I constantly forget as is.
Our characters in Sui Generis would remember much more than we do as gamers. It's all they do. If they hear Jane Doe can only be saved from an ogre with an enchanted spade, our characters will remember something important like that. However, us as people have other things to worry about, and if we leave the game for a week and return, no time has elapsed for our characters (still rearin' to go and find that enchanted space), but it's not unlikely for us as people to forget the current objective.
The Journal isn't really for our character's purpose, but ours as extensions of that character. Adventurer Dan knows his current task backwards and forwards, so the journal is there to remind us of what we already know.
The Hedge Knight
Member
It would be nice if you can bring it up when some one is talking and actually type (write) in it. So if he says "go to the cave that is up the north road and the third path down and to the right" you can type it down.
the0thMonkey
Member
I think this was already suggested, but why doesn't the journal essentially act as your memory. Instead of specific quest information (which would become to formalized and it would not be as fun), the journal would just contain what was said (or important snippets). You could also have the ability to annotate it if you wish.
Verva
Member
Journal = good idea
I feel like it's the little things that make games charming. Why not have a journal? Heck, make it an item that you actually carry on your person. Make NPC's have journals and notes and such. You could kill a guy out in the woods, and find on his body a handbook with scribblings of his past few days of his errands and such. Easy way to identify where his house may be, who he knows, his job, stuff like that. Then, you can go plunder his house and kidnap his wife and hold her for ransom to a rich uncle. All because the information contained in a to-do list in a handbook.
Seems like a good idea to me. Also ties into questing cause it's essentially giving you the info you need to take a next course of action. It doesn't just stop at killing the guy (Or pickpocketing him or whatever).
I feel like it's the little things that make games charming. Why not have a journal? Heck, make it an item that you actually carry on your person. Make NPC's have journals and notes and such. You could kill a guy out in the woods, and find on his body a handbook with scribblings of his past few days of his errands and such. Easy way to identify where his house may be, who he knows, his job, stuff like that. Then, you can go plunder his house and kidnap his wife and hold her for ransom to a rich uncle. All because the information contained in a to-do list in a handbook.
Seems like a good idea to me. Also ties into questing cause it's essentially giving you the info you need to take a next course of action. It doesn't just stop at killing the guy (Or pickpocketing him or whatever).
the0thMonkey
Member
^ Also, for NPCs, they could be procedurally generated because they are text.
Madoc
Project Lead
That seems to be based on the assumption that it will still hold true once you start playing Sui Generis which seems quite unrealistic.
calithlin
Insider
My having another life? Well given that monster list of ability combinations I pounded out last night (more than a year before the game is even close!) maybe you're right
Too bad I got the whole system wrong though >.> Looks like I need a version 2 hah.
Anyway, in all honesty I've got a pretty good memory, so that sort of issue usually doesn't affect me. Just playing devil's advocate.
walltar
Insider
It seems that besides our money we have to pay with our own souls ... two questions
1. Where do i sign it?
2. Do i have to do it with my own blood?
For the journal ... i hope there will be automated journal. I am planning to play 2games at once ... one will be singleplayer and second will be Co-op with my friend who don't have much time for playing. If i have to remember what to do in both games and keep my grocery list in my head at the same time i think my brain would melt.
