Message in "Plot"?

[Sunpeece]

I understand that instead of a traditional plot with a beginning, middle, and end, Sui Generis will just have events that unfold...just like history. I am in love with that. My question, however, is that will the events that unfold hold messages or themes for us to walk away with?

 

[Tony Dye]

The best tales are, just as this comment, open to interpretation.

 

[Madoc]

Don't kill everyone or you'll have no one to talk to. Deep, right?

 

[Sunpeece]

The best tales are, just as this comment, open to interpretation.

Well then will you guys be telling tales that illicit interpretation, instead of cut and dry archetypical tales?

 

[Pantheon]

Don't kill everyone or you'll have no one to talk to. Deep, right?

Depends on wether the dead stay dead or not.

 

[walltar]

Don't kill everyone or you'll have no one to talk to. Deep, right?

I hope there will be enough small unimportant villages for me to pillage and plunder ... you can't have a good day witnout a little of pillaging and plundering. And i definitely hope there won't be those pesky unkillable NPCs like there are in TES.

 

[Pantheon]

And i definitely hope there won't be those pesky unkillable NPCs like there are in TES.

This. So much.
"Hello good sir, I'm going to hit you repeatedly with a sword!"
"Oh noes, I'm dying!...Just kidding!"

I know it's to keep people from killing important NPCs, but if someone wants to get stuck in his game, LET HIM!
Players should feel the consequences of their behaviour, even if it means game over for them.

 

[Madoc]

That's totally core to our philosophy and part of what all the dynamic story stuff supports. No unkillable NPCs, no respawning NPCs, nothing like that. It's much more than just annoying, it very much hurts immersion and the whole idea that what you do matters.

 

[Psychomorph]

Don't kill everyone or you'll have no one to talk to. Deep, right?

But... I tend to kill first and talk later. What should I do?

 

[Sunpeece]

But... I tend to kill first and talk later. What should I do?

Learn. The game will be more timeless if you learned lessons from it.

 

[Psychomorph]

Learn...

...to speak to the dead... YES!

 

[Tony]

Learn. The game will be more timeless if you learned lessons from it.

If they have moral ambiguity and tough decisions? That's awesome! If they have Porky the Preacher? Not so awesome.

 

[walltar]

...to speak to the dead... YES!

I think we all saw Hellboy movie ... i see no problem there.

"Please mighty lord i need you to save my cow from evil bandits or we won't survive this winter"

"Well sorry man i allready killed you and burned your village, i dont think you need a cow ... but where did you hide reward gold?"

That's totally core to our philosophy and part of what all the dynamic story stuff supports. No unkillable NPCs, no respawning NPCs, nothing like that. It's much more than just annoying, it very much hurts immersion and the whole idea that what you do matters.

Good. May i openly say that i love you or would it be inappropriate?

 

[Algea]

Speaking of unkillable NPCs. Will there be children and if yes will they be killable? It's not that I enjoy, y'know, killing kids (oh God, Fallout and loading saves if those little shits were caught in the crossfire) but as far as I understand there are no exceptions to this 'everyone can be killed' rule. Also - there will be blood and probably gore, but what about nudity? What kind of ESRB rating SG is going to have? Mature?

But don't think I want these things, they are really unimportant in themselves, but if they will somehow move plot or deepen immersion I don't see why they shouldn't be implemented. Though of course it depends on what rating you want Sui Generis to have.

Also, I'm really sorry in advance if sometimes my messages are hard to understand. While I'm making progress with my English studies I'm still far from being proficient. So don't hesitate to clarify what I wanted to say if anything seems muddled.

 

[Pantheon]

If there are children (and there should be, if it should feel like a living world), then they should be killable.
Killing children in Fallout for example made you a child killer, which was frowned upon everywhere of course and so many people didn't like to interact with you and that's how it's supposed to be. Doing bad things should have really big consequences. Fallout was even a bit tame, imo. If you kill a child, you should be pretty much screwed, unless you want to fight townspeople whenever you enter a town/settlement. Every moraly normal person should be out to get you (maybe even something like a bounty on your head?), while groups like bandits and the like shouldn't care much about that, hell, maybe even welcome you into their ranks for it.

Children are definitely no must-have, though. There are tons of games without children like the GTA series and they still show a pretty realistic world.

 

[Algea]

If you kill a child, you should be pretty much screwed, unless you want to fight townspeople whenever you enter a town/settlement. Every moraly normal person should be out to get you (maybe even something like a bounty on your head?)

What if you kill a child and everyone else in a settlement (including chickens, those bastards always tell everyone in Skyrim that you committed a crime) - what then? As far as I understand there won't be any kind of global reputation (need confirmation from the devs though) so it won't be a problem.

Regarding killing children in original Fallout series - I wasn't afraid of child killer reputation per se, but when I saw how their tiny bodies were disfigured from being shot it was unacceptable for me. Ah, I'm just unable to roleplay evil bastard personality. Even for shits and giggles.

I'd vote for having children in SG. Whether they are killable or not. Frankly speaking I'm tired of not having normal families with children and elderly people in games. Everybody is so freaking young and healthy and use the same mesh (skeleton, figure type, perky boobs, every last thing except wrinkles, But being wrinkled is such a tiny part of being old in general) whatever their age is. It's a very annoying (though somewhat understandable) limitation. I know I shouldn't expect too much though and I won't. But if the devs haven't thought about it yet then it could possibly give them some food for thoughts.

 

[Madoc]

Our discussions on this topic have always ended in "no children". Consider also that we intend to have a believable reputation system (someone must witness or discover what you did and also recognise you for plausible reasons). It's sad to have no children but we also don't want to make a game where you can abuse them.

Such moral issues inevitably come up when making a realistic simulated world. We wouldn't want our game to be preachy but I do think it would cool if it was possible convey the pain and suffering that cruel actions can cause. In practice I don't think that would be easy to do but we don't intend to reward the player for being cruel. Killing people shouldn't just be funny or inconsequential.

 

[walltar]

Well there is a very big problem with children ... if you raid and burn village and let them live of even sell them to slavers to turn giant winch they will allways come back as heroes and kill you. Number one rule of every starting dark lord should be ... never let those little buggers live, even if they are highly valued by slavers.

 

[fluffydino2000]

Our discussions on this topic have always ended in "no children". Consider also that we intend to have a believable reputation system (someone must witness or discover what you did and also recognise you for plausible reasons). It's sad to have no children but we also don't want to make a game where you can abuse them.

In the brackets, please tell me that this means every individual must know what you did. I hated how on skyrim, if someone saw you commit a crime, they'd know, and as long as they survived, everyone would then know. It seems unrealistic to assume every guard would find out who committed a crime instantly. There should definitely be some kind of wanted poster system that guards/people have to see first before they know.

 

[Algea]

When you say 'abuse' do you mean murdering them or are there going to be sexual assaults (in general, not considering child issue at all)? Will there be sex? If yes how depicted will it be? I probably come as a really perverted and sick person, but honestly it's not that I want these things to happen, I just want to clarify them and to understand what kind of world we're talking about in Sui Generis and what kind of limitations we will have.

I'm okay with not having children in game (after all it's only logical if you want everybody be killable and don't want to raise 'kill a child' issue, I think it's more honest to not have them at all than to make them immortal), but what about elderly people?