What must SG have to leave a good first impression?

[Komuflage]

Could be tricky, as I don't thing SG will have levels as such - it will be a bit more open world.

One option would be for the tutorial 'levels' to be completely separate from the main game, just meant to allow you to learn/practice some aspect of gameplay in a very limited closed-off environment. Like in the AC series. New tutorial levels could be unlocked as and when you gain the relevant ability in-game, e.g. some thaumaturgical power. Of course, if the controls are very intuitive then that won't be required. Hmmmm... I've just realised that this is moving slightly away from the "first 5 mins" issue, thinking more about tutorials in general...

But a tutorial level can be a part of the rest of the world, just linear for the time being. Think the beginning of skyrim or oblivion for instance.

 

[Rob]

But a tutorial level can be a part of the rest of the world, just linear for the time being. Think the beginning of skyrim or oblivion for instance.

Or the beginning of The Witcher 1 (and most rpgs, tbh).

Could be a really good idea... if only so that the player isn't simply launched into an open world without a clue about what's going on, which can be overwhelmingly off-putting.

The more I think about it, the more this is sounding like the start of The Witcher 1... someone with some special powers wakes up somewhere with no recall of their previous life or powers, the people in the locality seem to know something about them and their past, and the villagers are fearful/suspicious of them because they're different... big changes are happening in the world; these changes/events will happen whether or not the character gets involved, but the character may influence the way things work out...

 

[Parco]

if there gonna be a tutorial then what about just having a separate "game-mode" you can access from the main menu, it will drop a fixed character in a small environment where you will be set on doing small simple tasks to learn the controls.
but personally i dont think a tutorial is needed, as i imagine it this game will be a find-it-out-by-yourself game, if someone is wondering about the controls they can always visit the option menu and have a look at the control settings.

 

[lvk]

While this thread hasn't seen posts in a while, I believe Sui Generis' first impression depends very, very largely on the player.

You actually don't know anything about the plot or world's history, and neither do most of the world's inhabitants. Some of them may even have false information. The development team has chosen to not disclose plot information even during the crucial crowdfunding stage. The following is from an early Kickstarter update:

We have not given you a story. We have intentionally lured you into thinking of this as a fairly typical fantasy RPG. Guess what? We don't like those either. We are of a skeptical nature and when faced with the usual fantasy claptrap, much like an inquisitive child, our answer is simply "but why?". There is lots of because in our world. We have taken what appears to be generic fantasy and given it a whole new twist. A lot of effort has gone into this and to reveal it would be to throw it all away. We hold it more dear than the funds we are trying to raise. If by not revealing it we fail in securing your support, then so be it.

They have done their best to not reveal many of the plot details even at the large risk of failing to secure funding, so it's pretty clear that you, as a player, will have to work to uncover them, and that it's one of the game's most prominent features - this is further supported by the following quote from the same Kickstarter update:

Yes, our world is under duress, you won't be picking daisies. As for a looming threat, you may have no idea what it is until it's too late.

Since you're so largely in control of your own game experience up to the point where you can miss the entire main plotline if you so decide, the first impression of Sui Generis depends on you, as well. You are given the option to miss the entire point of the game, and the game is fine with that, which is great!

However, one important thing that needs to be done is that it's quickly made clear that it's indeed not a 'fairly typical fantasy RPG', since while there's a lot of impressive and groundbreaking engine development going on, to most people gleaning the videos it will look like exactly that. This is probably what prompted the negative 'Sui Generic' kind of feedback; the misdirection from the videos is so good that even news websites end up missing the underlying intent if they don't read through the updates (gaming news websites posting uninformed articles? gasp!)

For people who picked up the game not knowing exactly what to expect, I hope the game at least alludes fairly quickly to the more complex nature of its events, so that people will realize the sheer potential of what the game has to offer (as demonstrated in Komuflage's post). While the combat is revolutionary, in terms of game introduction it should come second to the plot, as that will be what motivates players to complete the game. This is why I've completed Skyrim, even though the combat was fairly disappointing, and subsequently why I pretty much have not restarted since beating the main quest.

The story would be the player's motivation to keep playing the game the first time, and the game's intricate mechanics would keep the player coming back for more. I think the development team is well aware of everything stated above, I'm just trying to add to the thread.

 

[fluffydino2000]

How long have you been lurking without posting (much) lvk. You clearly know the game and that was a very good point. I guess it's pointless saying welcome to the forums.

But yeah, I agree, it probably is down to the player whether or not there early experiences are fun. If you don't try to do anything that will make the game react dynamically, you may not even notice that it is dynamic.

 

[lvk]

How long have you been lurking without posting (much) lvk. You clearly know the game and that was a very good point. I guess it's pointless saying welcome to the forums.

But yeah, I agree, it probably is down to the player whether or not there early experiences are fun. If you don't try to do anything that will make the game react dynamically, you may not even notice that it is dynamic.

I've been following the game (erratically) since I've been told about it in November 2012, and registered about five months ago. Thanks for the (formal) welcome! I only try to post when I feel there's truly something to add, and since the forum appears quite insightful, I don't get to post very often, and just enjoy what others have written. (Shoutout to Elric von Rabenfels, whose unique expertise and passion in his own field make for enjoyable posts.)

The latter you mentioned might be good or bad for Sui Generis. When I played Skyrim for the first time, it felt like the character interaction was a huge step up from Oblivion ("Hi! Hello! I saw a mudcrab today; fearsome creatures. Bye! Goodbye."), but it did become apparent a bunch of dialogue was specifically tailored to you visiting a village for the first time. In the preview videos they said that they could, for instance, freeze an NPC who'd then fall into a river, and then come to their senses elsewhere completely bewildered.

It later turns out it's mostly the NPC firing a one-liner before continuing with business as usual. Nevertheless, you learn to understand the limits of the game and appreciate the effort put into them.

With Sui Generis, where a lot of events are dynamic, it's hard to realize where the limits are (as far as I can tell; none of us have played the game of course) and in turn it's hard to truly make the player realize what the game is capable of. If the developers want to contribute to a positive first impression that keeps the player wanting to go, especially within the first 5 minutes or so, it seems like an incredibly difficult task to fit all of that into the length most people dedicate to deciding whether they think a game is interesting or not.

I think the developers actually don't even have the option of demonstrating the versatility of the game within a short amount of time; this can only become apparent when you've played for a while. In the end, for the best possible result, I think alluding to the complex plot in one way or another will become key to driving the player to play for at least a while, and from there the intricacy of combat, physics, the world and pretty much everything else will be able to carry it along for most players just fine.