Murf
Moderator
Guess that's where we disagree, the whole thing takes practice, lots of it. It fits with the rest of the combat in that sense, it also fits in with how your input directly affects your movements.
3 little suggestions that'd improve the game quite a bit
- Thread starter Nahkuri
- Start date
I suppose. It just feels clunky to me, and too easily leads to you either turning away from your opponent or doing the wrong attack.
I did a bit of sword+board "fencing" for shits and giggles with a reenactor once as a teenager. RTL, or LTR, or Diagonal or vertical or thrust, made no difference. You can do all that right away, you can try with a stick if you have doubts. The reason why he promptly proceeded to push my shit in was that I sucked at judging when to strike and how.
I firmly think that a video game with a very finely developed melee combat system such as Sui Generis should go for that feel. Easy to grasp, difficult to master. I do believe I heard that being mentioned in an early kickstarted video. Currently there's a bit of a learning curve to the grasping thing, that could be easily settled. Not to mention a click for RTL and click&draw for LTR(essentially, since you do have to keep facing the enemy) is a bit strange.
I did a bit of sword+board "fencing" for shits and giggles with a reenactor once as a teenager. RTL, or LTR, or Diagonal or vertical or thrust, made no difference. You can do all that right away, you can try with a stick if you have doubts. The reason why he promptly proceeded to push my shit in was that I sucked at judging when to strike and how.
I firmly think that a video game with a very finely developed melee combat system such as Sui Generis should go for that feel. Easy to grasp, difficult to master. I do believe I heard that being mentioned in an early kickstarted video. Currently there's a bit of a learning curve to the grasping thing, that could be easily settled. Not to mention a click for RTL and click&draw for LTR(essentially, since you do have to keep facing the enemy) is a bit strange.
tiny lampe
Insider
Yes; personally I love the idea of having to trace your swings with the mouse. If making things consistent was a concern, I'd rather both RTL and LTR require cursor movement and simply pressing LMB did a thrust.
Yeah, that was basically my suggestion with the different break down for where different attacks are registered. I think that could work well. Though, I'd like to have a bit more control over the power of a LTR swing. Right now it feels like they always need to be powerful horizontals and can't be diagonals like standing RTLs are. So, along with this change, if it happens, I'd like there to be some sort of sensitivity buffer to turning your character... it'd need testing.. because that could make your character feel slow to turn.
Guy
Member
There are several good options here. I would like to see all be possible, as a gamer preference. It seems that mappable keys would be the easiest alternative to start with. A gamer mouse with the extra buttons needs to be considered in my opinion. The game is certainly worthy of such an investment that I would use for one or two games ever.
But.
I would rather keep the current system if any alternative will significantly add to the development time. I would even pay a few bucks more for the option if that's what it took, even if I decided to play the game pure. But again, maybe not at the cost of a delay in development.
But.
I would rather keep the current system if any alternative will significantly add to the development time. I would even pay a few bucks more for the option if that's what it took, even if I decided to play the game pure. But again, maybe not at the cost of a delay in development.
Jesus. I just want to say that I hate the fanboys retards flooding this thread with imbecile messages going against common sense
If you can train yourself to attack from the left side, it doesn't mean the current system is good, just as a stick is not a better weapon than a sword just because it can kill people too.
Thie OP has a point with his 10-o-clock system being unergonomic, switching it to 12-o-clock would improve gameplay alot.
If you can train yourself to attack from the left side, it doesn't mean the current system is good, just as a stick is not a better weapon than a sword just because it can kill people too.
Thie OP has a point with his 10-o-clock system being unergonomic, switching it to 12-o-clock would improve gameplay alot.
NachoDawg
Member
12-o-clock would mean i have to have the camera right behind me to know which side im going to attack from.
Go into the game, have your camera look at the character from the side and point infront of the character to see what i mean. From this perspective, you will decide your swing based on the mouse being above or below the character's line of sight, which is even more confusing that the 10-o-clock system where you have to purposely point over the left shoulder. I don't want to accidentally swing from the wrong direction
TwoPumpWarrior
Insider
I think 12 o'clock would make for inconsistent swings. Right now the LtR is admittedly exaggerated but at least I know that I will perform 'only' a LtR using the 10 o'clock division. At 12 o'clock, any twitch or deviation of my mouse is gonna cause a RtL 'or' a LtR and that just sounds horrible. Is it not better to have a consistent scheme rather than an easier, yet volatile one?
Guy
Member
Fanboys? She-it. We have just put enough time in learning to master(ish) a technique instead of asking to change the whole thing back to centered following camera with straight WASD control and buttons for every attach option. Like every other old assed game out there.
Personally, while I hated the controls when I started too, I can now do well enough at it to understand why they are laid out as such. There are now rhythms to fights and I take not a hit when I do my part. Now that I understand.
Took a while.
Spend the time, it is worth it.
TwoPumpWarrior
Insider
So what you are implying is that the current scheme is in fact flawed? I can argue that the system isn't perfect but the same can be said for every game. That's just the problem with input in games, it's never 1:1. However with your statement, I can't even say that I really enjoy the controls without proving your point (sorta).
Sir NotABot
Member
Obviously you're allowed to like the current system in some respects, but for an example of what I'm aiming at, in kerbal space program, for a long time there were two menu buttons for exiting a flight. One went to the space centre menu, leaving your ship untouched wherever it was, and one went back to the space centre menu and deleted your ship. The second button caused much wailing and gnashing of teeth when people accidentally selected it after a 6 month mission to mars and there were constant forum complaints about it. It has since been removed but in the meantime there were people on the forums essentially defending the entirely pointless button 2, replying "so just be careful which button you click", which is entirely fair but also misses the point completely.
Or in Supreme Commander, all the unit explosions are white and reviews complained of it being fairly dull graphically. During the beta testing I made this point on the forums and the 5000 post club vehemently disagreed, saying that they were future tanks and wouldn't produce orange fireballs and black smoke because they were powered by antimatter. Okay, good fluffwanking but again, missing the point.
Possibly there exist some slight tweaks to the camera system and controls which would make exanima easier to pick up without hours of arena training, and you'd be very silly to oppose such tweaks so long as they left that juicy physics system intact. That's what I'm getting at.
Or in Supreme Commander, all the unit explosions are white and reviews complained of it being fairly dull graphically. During the beta testing I made this point on the forums and the 5000 post club vehemently disagreed, saying that they were future tanks and wouldn't produce orange fireballs and black smoke because they were powered by antimatter. Okay, good fluffwanking but again, missing the point.
Possibly there exist some slight tweaks to the camera system and controls which would make exanima easier to pick up without hours of arena training, and you'd be very silly to oppose such tweaks so long as they left that juicy physics system intact. That's what I'm getting at.
Guy
Member
Sure. Agreed. I believe (not an insider, so this is strictly observation and conjecture) that they are working on making it smoother, including animations. Also, as the number of skills (swings/attacks) are incorporated I would imagine another way is to be found for how to activate a particular type. Personally, I am hoping for fully mappable controls at that point, so I can get a gamer mouse and assign my attacks to it. We may be looking at the current system for the basics strikes (LtR, RtL, Overhead) and new content is keyed, but I hope it is all keyed at some point in time.
