Creature Suggestions

[Pilluminati]

Hopefully the low fantasy transfers to this aspect of the game too.
Every imaginary creature should feel special. Not like: oh just another skeleton.
Physics should always play its part.
Example:
Gigantic 200m tall monster approaches.
Oh wait it's just level 5 I can just one-shot it despite of it's size and it can barely scratch me because of my stats.

I know there won't be levels, bare in mind it's just an example. I always hated that in games like Diablo.
You should be able to see if the enemy is a tough opponent. In Diablo (Or pretty much any ARPG) a monster from Act 1 could easily be placed in Act 3 or 4 and no one would notice a thing, because the only thing that matters are its stats.

 

[Stephen]

Hopefully the low fantasy transfers to this aspect of the game too.
Every imaginary creature should feel special. Not like: oh just another skeleton.
Physics should always play its part.
Example:
Gigantic 200m tall monster approaches.
Oh wait it's just level 5 I can just one-shot it despite of it's size and it can barely scratch me because of my stats.

I know there won't be levels, bare in mind it's just an example. I always hated that in games like Diablo.
You should be able to see if the enemy is a tough opponent. In Diablo (Or pretty much any ARPG) a monster from Act 1 could easily be placed in Act 3 or 4 and no one would notice a thing, because the only thing that matters are its stats.

I think they have this in mind, we have confirmation there are no levels or stats(?), but the only thing that improves is your ability to swing a sword or fire a bow. And larger adversaries will be tougher, not because they have more strength or vitality points, but because they are generally just large and are most likely going to be swinging something rather big at you, and this is where the physics based combat comes in. You will die if a giant rock or a tree gets hurled directly at you, or you will barely feel a thing if a rusty sword slashes at your plate mail armor. In any other rpg, the tree or rock could do 5 damage to the players massive 5000 health pool. Or the sword could do 1500 damage per swing and 1 shot any low level character in full plate mail. I love this system.

 

[MowLiao]

and I'd like to see predator type monsters either eating their kills or dragging them off rather than wandering off or attacking something else like they do in every RPG ever

That brings an idea to mind (even though it isn't relevant to topic)... Can we, as the character, try to eat what we kill (including animals eg. rabbits, and humans)? Obviously, we wouldn't be able to eat the whole body at once, because seriously, who has a stomach that large? Just would be a fun thing to implement for those who want to be seriously evil. =P

 

[Stephen]

That brings an idea to mind (even though it isn't relevant to topic)... Can we, as the character, try to eat what we kill (including animals eg. rabbits, and humans)? Obviously, we wouldn't be able to eat the whole body at once, because seriously, who has a stomach that large? Just would be a fun thing to implement for those who want to be seriously evil. =P

Somebody actually mentioned a hunger/thirst mechanic some where on these forums, sorry for not remembering who :S, but that would be interesting, instead of just buying 20 loafs of bread and fill up your health like any other rpgs, you have to actually make the bread, or catch the deer, cook it, eat it etc.

But then you cook it wrong and give your self salmonella and go ill for 2 weeks, game time, which is 1:1. D:

 

[the0thMonkey]

Somebody actually mentioned a hunger/thirst mechanic some where on these forums, sorry for not remembering who :S, but that would be interesting, instead of just buying 20 loafs of bread and fill up your health like any other rpgs, you have to actually make the bread, or catch the deer, cook it, eat it etc.

But then you cook it wrong and give your self salmonella and go ill for 2 weeks, game time, which is 1:1. D:

Yeah, let's go Day-Z on this game! But seriously, I think that is one of Day Z's better mechanics. I know it's not really an RPG but it does have similar goals in terms of realism so it might be a good source of inspiration.

 

[Tony Dye]

I've talked a little with Madoc about this, because it matters in early-game quest building and it's important to the tone. Right now we're not planning on having aggressive wolfpacks in the game, because that sort of fantasy-world aggression is very much counter to their RL nature. I think the largest "normal" predator you'll encounter is a bear, and we aren't planning right now on including any big cats. Boars perhaps - they fit the setting and RL ones are surprisingly ornery in the wild.

All of this is subject to dramatic change, of course... so far I've only been involved in a couple of short brainstorming-type conversations about it.

 

[Rob]

I've talked a little with Madoc about this, because it matters in early-game quest building and it's important to the tone. Right now we're not planning on having aggressive wolfpacks in the game, because that sort of fantasy-world aggression is very much counter to their RL nature. I think the largest "normal" predator you'll encounter is a bear, and we aren't planning right now on including any big cats. Boars perhaps - they fit the setting and RL ones are surprisingly ornery in the wild.

All of this is subject to dramatic change, of course... so far I've only been involved in a couple of short brainstorming-type conversations about it.

Hi Tony!
Knowing nothing about the real-life aggression of wolf packs, you inspired me to do a bit of googleing, and I found this article in the Daily Hick:
http://dailyinterlake.com/news/local_montana/article_ada2e302-e891-11df-826c-001cc4c03286.html

(P.S. not trying to argue with your statement - just thought it was interesting!!! )

 

[Rob]

Thinking seriously about wild animals in games, e.g. wolf packs...

One thing that's unrealistic is how you've got to get within X meters of them and then they suddenly see you, and then automatically attack you.

Surely, in real life, animals such as pack wolves know of your existence way before they're on your radar (unless they howl), and even then they wouldn't automatically attack you. Perhaps it would be nice to have mechanics to allow such wild animals to have more diverse behaviours, such as:

• Attack;
• Ignore;
• Avoid and run away;
• Circle, looking for an opportune moment to attack;
• Stalk, watching with interest - not yet sure whether to attack, run away, or ignore.

Their behaviour could depend on your behaviour, i.e. the signals you're sending out.

Of course, this could be getting a bit complex, but it would sure make it more realistic, and go further than other games have gone before!!!

 

[Tony Dye]

Heh, fighting off another top-tier predator for a hastily butchered elk you left in the woods for a day then returned (with your pack of humans!) to recover... isn't quite the same situation as simply wandering through the forest and suddenly getting attacked.

 

[the0thMonkey]

That sounds really good. I don't think it would be very difficult to implement semi realistic animal behaviour. Also, this would really add to immersion. Imagine if you had a nerve rattling standoff with a wolf before you finally engaged.

Pretty much anything is preferable to the wolves from Skyrim!

 

[Rob]

Heh, fighting off another top-tier predator for a hastily butchered elk you left in the woods for a day then returned (with your pack of humans!) to recover... isn't quite the same situation as simply wandering through the forest and suddenly getting attacked.

So I suppose the closest would be wandering through the woods and finding a wolf-pack already engaged in eating an elk. I suppose they'd attack you, but probably only if you were stupid enough to get too close...

 

[Zervostyrd]

@Rob

One thing that's unrealistic is how you've got to get within X meters of them and then they suddenly see you, and then automatically attack you.

I consider the "X meter aggro" thing unrealistic. But I tend to imagine that the animals know of your presence and most top predators don't back down and run just because there is another predator in close.

Even though bears and wolves have a excellent nose and can smell humans for miles, if the wind blows in the wrong direction it's likely the bear don't smell you until your to close for the animals comfort. Also if an animal is preoccupied with something else it's not that likely that they notice you until you're to close. And a third reason could be if you are to close to a important place for the animals. And it's quite easy for humans to come close to animals, happens all the time...

While I generally agree with your diverse behaviour, as I said most predators (espcially top tiers) doesn't back down just because there is another predator in the area.

A creature suggestion would be Wolverines! They seem scarce in the world of games. However they pack a good punch even though they are small (~25kg 40cm high 1m long). (latin gulo gulo = glutton glutton) They can easily kill dears (Reindeer/Caribou sometimes elk and mooses) And have been known to attack coyotes dogs and Wolf pups.

 

[fluffydino2000]

@Rob
A creature suggestion would be Wolverines! They seem scarce in the world of games. However they pack a good punch even though they are small (~25kg 40cm high 1m long). (latin gulo gulo = glutton glutton) They can easily kill dears (Reindeer/Caribou sometimes elk and mooses) And have been known to attack coyotes dogs and Wolf pups.

Not to mention the honeybadger, it has to be one of the most fierce creatures around.
Amuse yourselves: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080804133628AAYEwp1

 

[Captain Weasel]

Bare Mettle has stated they want the game world to be believable. Most creatures will probably not be magical, and I think that's great. On the other hand you want to be in awe with the creatures you find and fight on your travels. That's why I think creatures that have actually existed are a good starting point. For example these passive herbivores:
Deinotherium. I can just imagine dodging its tusks and attacking him on the side.

Glyptodon (with doedicurus in the back). His weak spot would be his head, but he would turn away and try to bludgeon you around with its tail.

And many more, which I won't put here so the page won't be full of giant images.
One other game world which uses prehistoric animals that I can think of is Tamriel, but they usually stick to the very famous creatures like sabre tooth lions and mammoths. Either way the animals obviously shouldn't have actually existed, but I love it when they look like they could have.

 

[the0thMonkey]

...Most creatures will probably not be magical...

I don't know if that's true. If we consider the sampling of creatures we've seen (which aren't numerous so it could go either way), they do seem to be magical. The skeletons and ghosts are magical as well as the demons discussed in the game world story post. The only non magical creature we've seen is porky.

I think that there should be a mix. Plausibility is key. So there can be non-magical creatures (boars, wolves, megafauna) but also magical ones that make sense. I think it is really important that the game lore supports the fantastical creatures because if it did not it, it would be very immersion breaking. So, creatures should be plausible in a low fantasy setting.

That said, I would love to see the creatures you mentioned (especially the first one) in this game!

 

[Pilluminati]

Would be insanely cool if creatures had more random behaviour than just walking around/attacking you.
Cautious/Threatening/Fleeing/Hostile/Curious/Passive. Of course this might be way too much asked.
But pretty much anything else than the current Hostile/Passive is better.

 

[MNONE]

Hi Tony!
Knowing nothing about the real-life aggression of wolf packs, you inspired me to do a bit of googleing, and I found this article in the Daily Hick:
http://dailyinterlake.com/news/local_montana/article_ada2e302-e891-11df-826c-001cc4c03286.html

(P.S. not trying to argue with your statement - just thought it was interesting!!! )

Kind of OT, and not meaning to start a discussion either, but I think the answer lies in the first line: 'Two Flathead Valley men who were retrieving an elk in the South Fork Flathead drainage say they ended up fending off a pack of aggressive wolves Saturday.' The wolves were after the elk, not the men. [edit: doi, Tony already mentioned that, my bad]
Tony's right, wolves aren't the aggressive ones in nature, by and large (and boars can be really territorial sods when the mood takes them). As Marshall Sahlins says, the adage homo homini lupus [man is wolf to man] is actually a pretty big libel on wolves, by comparing them to humans.

Some of Captain Weasel's suggestions would be quite fun/interesting alternatives to some of the stock choices made in RPGs.

Or indeed 'realistic' wolves - you'd meet them just as often as you do in, say, Skyrim, but you'd be much less likely to fight, but rather warily circle one another until one or both sides managed to place some distance between you.

 

[Tony Dye]

I love that the men lost in that news story. Their clearly more sensible horses forced them to leave, the wolf pack driving them out of the forest while avoiding more than the initial loss of one member during the first meeting. The men kept shooting, but didn't hit anything else, and the horses just dragged them along as they fled the wolves. Then the pack returned and ate the elk. Neither they, nor the bear who came along later, bothered the body of the one wolf that was killed.

 

[BrecMadak]

I dig the idea of changing behaviours of creatures that are dependent on various conditions along with the idea of implementing pre-historic creatures since they had been exist over many million years ago, would fit quite well with the nature of SG. Also since most of them have had in-born armor that solely would even be enough to heathen up close quarter fights.

Let me add my favourite pre-historic creature: Chupacabra;

​

"The Chupacabra is a Cryptid (a term is used in cryptozoology to refer to a creature whose existence has been suggested but not scientifically confirmed) said to attack and drain the blood of livestock and possibly other animals, reported mainly in South America."



Reapers (from Ultima Online universe);

​

They are binded to ground, immobile spellcasters, with high spell resistance abilities. One of my favourite monster from UO.


Man eating Plants, poisonous giant insects and the likes would be cool and very exciting.


One cool abomination;
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-C50RORczGDc/T-rN_nPFKvI/AAAAAAAAAm0/HK3yFOt30Ak/s1600/CORROSIVE CARCASS - Composition of Flesh CD cover art.jpg

Sick, twisted and ugly as hell abysmals from Berserk manga, that are on higher fantasy level;
http://i13.mangareader.net/berserk/13/berserk-26447.jpg
http://i30.mangareader.net/berserk/13/berserk-26449.jpg
http://i26.mangareader.net/berserk/13/berserk-26454.jpg
http://i16.mangareader.net/berserk/13/berserk-26463.jpg
http://i35.mangareader.net/berserk/13/berserk-26495.jpg
http://i11.mangareader.net/berserk/13/berserk-26518.jpg
http://i11.mangareader.net/berserk/13/berserk-26519.jpg

 

[Cooper Holt]

and I'd like to see predator type monsters either eating their kills or dragging them off rather than wandering off or attacking something else like they do in every RPG ever

I completely agree.