Update #28: Update #28

Discussion in 'Announcements' started by Kieran, Jun 18, 2014.

  1. crashingtingler

    crashingtingler Insider

    Messages:
    182
    I hate the shield users in this game. shields op. and 1 handed weapons REALLY hurt, it seems a bit imbalanced to me.
     
  2. InfamousPotato

    InfamousPotato Insider

    Messages:
    35
    I don't have access to the alpha, and I don't know anything about combat irl, but shouldn't a shield and sword have a huge advantage against just a sword? If the odds were equal with or without a shield, what would be he point?
     
  3. InfamousPotato

    InfamousPotato Insider

    Messages:
    35
    Edit: sorry, double post.
     
  4. Minq

    Minq Insider

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    105
    It's weird how for us humans, the two handed sword is better. However, for the AI, a shield is really hard to get past, especially the larger shields. Maybe we just aren't very good yet. :/
     
  5. Tony

    Tony Moderator

    Messages:
    1,810
    Well, considering the AI has all the same limitations as a player would, and abides by the same rules too, I believe it is a sign of good AI programming that they can use shields effectively. I haven't had time to mess around with shields yet since the latest patch but I plan on doing so eventually.
     
  6. tiny lampe

    tiny lampe Insider

    Messages:
    309
    It isn't weird at all. 2-handed weapons are the most effective way of playing offensively. (Large) shields are the most effective way of playing defensively.

    Instead of playing with the goal of defeating the AI, try to play with the goal of surviving as long as possible. Equip a shield and see how much easier the task becomes. Also, compare fighting 1H vs 2H opponents. Which type kills you easily?
     
  7. Minq

    Minq Insider

    Messages:
    105
    Actually, that sword and shield lady always beats me, but the two handed axe guy is relatively easy. Of course, the game is still in alpha and many changes are likely to come. Any tips on beating shielded types?
     
  8. Fawz

    Fawz Insider

    Messages:
    666
    For me the most reliable way of beating opponents that use shields has been to go on a relentless offence by focusing on the unguarded side (the opponent's right side). If you're quick you can start the fight with a backhand blow that staggers the opponent. From there stay on their ungarded side and don't give them room to properly position themselves.

    That's what usually works for me at least. I found that against shielded opponents you really don't want to let them play in their comfort zone where they keep their shield in your face while constantly hitting you with light blows you can't do much against.
     
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  9. turtleman155

    turtleman155 Insider

    Messages:
    750
    most of the time the only reason i lose using shields is when the hand clips through and is hit :(
     
  10. Madoc

    Madoc Project Lead

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    1,066
    That's actually just a visual issue, your hand can't be hit when you have a shield equipped. Blows can glance off your shield and hit you anyway though.
     
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  11. turtleman155

    turtleman155 Insider

    Messages:
    750
    yeah its kind of annoying :D though sometimes such as just then an opponent can hit my shield dead on and there is no glancing and i can take injury from it; this just happened then when i was fighting the halberd woman and she hit my shield ( the round one from the sword and shield woman) and did damage without glancing. why does this happen?
     
  12. Scarecrow

    Scarecrow Insider

    Messages:
    498
    Pics or didn't happen.

    No serriously though, you should post a short video of it if you can. If that should be impossible, then showing the bug through a video might help a lot. Personally I have not experienced it.
     
  13. Madoc

    Madoc Project Lead

    Messages:
    1,066
    With the halberd it's easy for the head to hit you even though you block the handle because the head is quite large. Other than that it really shouldn't happen, we use very accurate continuous collision detection. Continuous means that it's not the object's current position that's tested but its path through space and collisions can't be missed.

    It's possible that the graphics and phyiscs are not perfectly in synch, the graphics extrapolates from what the physics was doing recently and isn't always perfectly up to date but this should be very negligeable, it seems unlikely that there's a noticeable visual discrepancy.
     
  14. turtleman155

    turtleman155 Insider

    Messages:
    750
    im not sure maybe the spike hit my arm but i couldn't see it due to the camera angle.
    the game is definately solid most of the time.
     
  15. CountReiniardThe3

    CountReiniardThe3 Insider

    Messages:
    113
    As the team is using feedback to make future changes I just want to say that I really enjoy the balance changes (if any, since sometimes it seems things change but the development team says otherwise).

    One thing I notice is now SHIELDS WORK! One handed + Shield seem to be more useful than just using a giant 2-hander all the time, I think this makes the game much better, because on the flip side you can knock people down with the 2 hander weapon which I cant do much of without it (until things like kicking are added, and punching/grappling).

    For instance I can two hit kill people with a 2 handed weapon, spamming swings gets ME killed in return.
    Oh and it should be known that the longer handed weapons are excellent for attacking the opponents legs while the 1 handed weapons are more useful for going for a persons face or mid-sides. Good work. I can't wait for the build that has a map and a save function = Game of The Century.
     
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  16. Bibidibop

    Bibidibop Insider

    Messages:
    89
    This is a great update.

    As someone who does not have alpha access, does the improved control mean players will be able to swing weapons too far, or too fast, and have it result in slower attack recovery and softer precision? Conversely, short or slow swings would result in faster recovery/more precise control?

    If dismemberment is in, and if stats can be completely arbitrary, could a sufficiently strong character cleave another character in half?

    Regular leather is definitely useless against weapons, I can attest to that personally when a tree attacked me and tore my leather jacket. Poor jacket. :( A cordovan or goat leather jacket might have stood up better, but I digress. However, boiled leather armor has good impact characteristics. I'm guessing it could help with stabbing/cutting a little, too.

    I recently read about paper armor. The Chinese would use it to cheaply armor soldiers, especially at sea, except it was as effective as metal armor. Also, apparently wet materials, even skin, are more resistant to cutting. Just a random relevant fact.
    From what I've read, alum tanning is ancient like vegetable tanning, just not as ancient. People near volcano would know how to use mineral tanning. I know, it's not chrome tanning though.

    I think the first washing process might turn people off more, depending on the culture and period. In Europe they would use horse urine for the first soaking, I think. Urine is naturally sterile and has amounts of chlorine, both would help prevent bacterial growth in the dead skin.

    Also, wine skins. They couldn't have thought leather particularly disgusting if just about everyone was satisfied with drinking wine out of leather.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2014
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  17. cnileoleman

    cnileoleman Insider

    Messages:
    179
    My blacksmithing gloves are deerskin, and I must say they weren't anything I expected. Their ability to handle heat aside, they are amazing. Very flexible, soft, and still really tough. I understand that a modern method was likely used, but I would definitely wear an armor made out of it. It doesn't creak, barely rustles, keeps one insulated (wouldn't freeze on my travels.) and is very difficult to cut. (Not that I've tried much, but I have no fear when holding a blade by the edge with these) I was under the impression that leather in Europe was traditionally made from cow? I'll confess to being Jon Snow in this matter. (Knows nothing)
     
  18. Elric von Rabenfels

    Elric von Rabenfels Insider

    Messages:
    297
    I'm sorry about the small ninja assault, but I don't have time for more.

    I have no fear holding a sharp sword by the edge with my bare hands, nor should anyone. I will even hold my sharp swords by the edge and halfsword with them bare-handed if need be.

    As long as you have a good grip on the blade, nothing will happen.

    Blades cut through motion and friction. I bet my old, battered pauldrons on that you'd cut right through that leather with a proper cutting motion, as long as there is a realistic body filling it, or behind it. Stabs would of course penetrate, I'm sure.

    The only leather that will stand up to cutting (and potentially thrusts) is very thick and boiled leather, but that is just as rigid and plate, with worse resistance against all kinds of damage.
     
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  19. Sneil

    Sneil Insider

    Messages:
    225
    Thank you for that. Sometimes I think we tend to forget that here...
     
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  20. CountReiniardThe3

    CountReiniardThe3 Insider

    Messages:
    113
    I would like to state that with the recent combat alpha you've improved the controls 1000%, the precision for dodging by double tab is giving you a chance to survive and actually fight. The over all controls feel less like dancing puppets and more like controlling a fighter. I am able to dodge now, move in for strikes, and weave through close range strikes all the while using my fighters hand to parry or block, very big improvements and I hope this amount of control is kept and improved upon in the future. (Sorry for doubting your future design decisions, but with the recent trends in gaming industry you understand why I ask.)
     
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