Daemons, Demons and Dragons... And the likes of it

Scarecrow

Insider
You should touch the game "The last of us" hard man. Touch it hard... But seriously, its a great game.

As for dragons not being in the game, im definitely cool with that. I agree that they have lost their charm over the years they have been used. Creating something original is much cooler, but you can of course get inspired by other currently "existing" fantasy creatures. I hope they will come up with some great designs for them, in terms of appearance and game play.
 

Lathspell

Member
Personally I'm all for these giant creatures, they're in to few games nowadays.

But they need to be strong as hell, and sparse. not a la Skyrim with dragons everywhere. Maybe like 2-3 in the whole game at max, and they should be "impossible" for a normal character who haven't played 5+ playthroughs to beat.

I know that some people here on the forums don't want that sort of thing, but personally I'm all for it, IF it's done right.

I dunno how climbing on enemies will work in a isometric game though.

I agree that they have lost their charm over the years they have been used.
I'm with you about dragons dino sir,

dragons supposedly are a Extremely rare and powerful beings, now in games you look under a rock and you'll find dragons and with a few swings they're dead and visually their all the same

I'm remembering BG , where dragons were just a few, very powerful and Intelligent creatures

anyway don't care that much about dragons, the only ones I love are those in MTG <3

that's why mighty dragons lost their charm

I think if mythical or non human creatures will be added, they should be hard to kill where your (not character's) skill and dextery are tested

if you want my opinnion some minotaurs will be cool, just pick some your ogres and put them horns
 

Kale

Insider
On a random note... will there be type specific weapons? Like Dragon Slayer Sword that.... kills dragon super fast?
 

Acds

Insider
Anyone who has played Dragon's Dogma will know that dragons (and huge creatures in general) do still have plenty of charm, assuming that they are done right (for how to not do a dragon refer to Skyrim).
That said SG isn't Dragon's Dogma (though monster climbing with physics might be really cool) and huge enemies would just be "target legs until it falls over, then hit weakspot, rinse and repeat". Anything over twice the size of an ogre will probably turn into just that.

As for demons, going by Madoc's post there won't be actual demons (though the definition of demon varies so much, it might be that Madoc means "it's SG's version of demons, but might not be like your usual ones"), just creatures similar to/mistaken for demons. One thing I hate in games even more than easy and expendable dragons are easy and expendable demons. I like the idea of there being a "hell" (which can be anything from a place to another dimension or plane of existence) which is way more than just some lava and ash themed, and instead focusing more on darkness, descent into madness and constant psychological horror (now that I think about it that sounds an awful lot like the Cthulhu mythos), and definitely not something that anyone short of a demi-god can enter easily to slay whatever rules it.
 

Lathspell

Member
(now that I think about it that sounds an awful lot like the Cthulhu mythos), and definitely not something that anyone short of a demi-god can enter easily to slay whatever rules it.
you remind me one of my favorite god/demon-like entitie was that guy on dragonborn hermaeus mora, best thing in skyrim for me at least
 

mcmanusaur

Member
I've just read through the first few posts in this thread, and... Sui Generis will have NewGame+? o_O
What are the details on that, if anyone would mind filling me in?
 
Madoc said "The idea is that you create a world instance and a character and yes, you can create new world instances and drop an existing character in."

From what I can remember (difficult to search for quotes as "new" is too short) from discussions, NG+ will not be in any way different. You can create as many characters and worlds as you like and change which character is in which world whenever you like. So I don't think by achieving anything you unlock anything, more that you'll be able to influence the world with a more advanced character from another one.
 

mcmanusaur

Member
Madoc said "The idea is that you create a world instance and a character and yes, you can create new world instances and drop an existing character in."

From what I can remember (difficult to search for quotes as "new" is too short) from discussions, NG+ will not be in any way different. You can create as many characters and worlds as you like and change which character is in which world whenever you like. So I don't think by achieving anything you unlock anything, more that you'll be able to influence the world with a more advanced character from another one.
Okay, that I can deal with. Thanks for the help.
 
A few things I thought I should remind / inform you of:

1) You will not see any dragons in SG.
Thank you!
3) We have plans for rare large monstrous creatures but these will likely not appear until late in the game's development.
Please don't add to large creatures, It will ruin the game and the serious feeling to it. Creatures should have somewhat fantasy look , but not an unrealistic sized compared to the world.
Look at Diablo 2, the larges you could face was Diablo himself and he was huge, and yet he was only twice or thrice the big as the playable character and that was enough to make it realistic and yet awesome. Nowadays like in Diablo 3 even a simple boss is 10x bigger than the playable character
..god I hate that!..No just stay on track and don´t fuck up this game...pls.

On the topic of giant creatures, I find that beyond a certain size the fights just become less and less fun. The larger the creature the more mechanical the fight becomes. A good example of combat against large creatures in my opinion is Vindictus. It has great action gameplay (especially with some classes) and the boss fights in that game can be ridiculously good fun but with time they added larger and larger creatures and the fights became stupid to the point where it's almost reduced to a classic tab targeting MMO raid. Yuck.
+1 , I share your thoughts..thanks for bringing this so far great looking game :)
 

Lathspell

Member
Please don't add to large creatures, It will ruin the game and the serious feeling to it. Creatures should have somewhat fantasy look , but not an unrealistic sized compared to the world.
Look at Diablo 2, the larges you could face was Diablo himself and he was huge, and yet he was only twice or thrice the big as the playable character and that was enough to make it realistic and yet awesome. Nowadays like in Diablo 3 even a simple boss is 10x bigger than the playable character
..god I hate that!..No just stay on track and don´t fuck up this game...pls.
all depends on game mechanics, I insist on dragon battles in BG 2 those things are huge and battles were fun as hell... but yeah nowadays big game developers are just trying to make games more "epic" by adding ultra sized bosses that screw battles
 

ZaratanCho

Insider
Like with everything execution changes things dramatically, comparing a concept to something created from that concept doesn't make much sense. It is not good or bad.

Just making something huge and think it will be epic" is silly too (In most games it isn't because of how it is/are executed). ;D Anything can be realistic, even huge beings, if made with sense and logic. But from game mechanics point of view certain sizes of enemies will just not work well or not work at all, as Madoc said.
 

Komuflage

Insider
Like with everything execution changes things dramatically, comparing a concept to something created from that concept doesn't make much sense. It is not good or bad.

Just making something huge and think it will be epic" is silly too (In most games it isn't because of how it is/are executed). ;D Anything can be realistic, even huge beings, if made with sense and logic. But from game mechanics point of view certain sizes of enemies will just not work well or not work at all, as Madoc said.
As an example of your first point. Look at Skyrim Vs Dragons Dogma.

Skyrim had huge ass dragons, but the mechanics behind them was poorly executed, hence the fights fell dull as hell.

Dragons Dogma had huge ass dragons as well, but the mechanics behind them were decently executed (could be much better) hence the fights were actually somewhat trilling, and being a few lvls to low, fighting a huge ass troll, could take you quite some time, and you would have to stay on ur toes for the whole time.

Now I understand that to big creatures wont work in a isometric game. But huge creatures can be a good thing to a game, and a well made huge boss will (for me) be more trilling than a well made human size boss.

Using Lupicus (x10 times a human Norn in size?) from Gw2; it's a great example of a huge boss made right (not perfect though) the boss room is huge, giving the boss plenty of room to move around, the camera zooms out much more (Could be used in an isometric game as well) and he's not just a 1pixel wide character with a huge texture, (No weird clipping or similar) and in the end, the fight feels much more epic, just due to his enormous size.



Now I'm not saying that all bosses in Sui Generis should be colossal, I actually prefer if there's only a few, and optimal (Hence they can be a little bit more difficult, since they are not required to finish the game) I'm just saying that there are means to support big creatures, even in a isometric game.
 

BrecMadak

Insider
what about demons, trying to tempting you, offering great rewards for making evil quests?....that should be interesting

I want to see a lord of the pit in this game or griselbrand :p
I concur, not only from humans would it be possible to get quests, but also from unearthly entities; that one couldn't guess if that entitie even will keep his promise at the end of the quest. Perhaps. What if he actually gonna mislead you by giving you false information and trap you who knows. *giggles*
 

lvk

Insider
what about demons, trying to tempting you, offering great rewards for making evil quests?....that should be interesting
You may actually be on an 'evil' quest before you know it!

The Sui Generis Kickstarter - Update #4 said:
Nothing is as it seems. There is no evil in our world. There may be lack of scruples, ruthlessness or just genuine oversight, but motives are often complex and valid to those who hold them.
It's just not categorized as traditional evil. It's up to you and your (character's) morals to decide what is and isn't.
 
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