[OPINION] Repeated Failure is Getting Frustrating

Madoc

Project Lead
I would add that there used to be a brief but noticeable delay for operating the latch before the door would open, unfortunately this proved to be an impassable barrier for some people. It would seem as though playing a game reduces many people's intelligence to that of a dog or significantly worse, furiously clawing at the door with the mouse becomes the only possible solution. Decades of regularly pulling doors open is completely forgotten, an alien and unfathomable concept.

Games do have an extremely peculiar effect on people...
 

burgzaza

Insider
I may have seen lickstarter videos that showed doors action, I don't know... but it felt natural for me to pull/push the first door, as you can do with other objects in the room... Feeling pretty proud of it.

I've also seen a video more recently, of a player that was playing for the first time and said "ok, now some regular dungeon searching" while moving chairs and stuff around. Not even realizing that he probably never searched a dungeon like that, actually moving stuff with very accurate physics involved.
 

K.L.R.G.

Member
@NachoDawg : I don't rant. I'm just annoying people about some minor details in an apart from that surprisingly realistic game-environment. And I am not convinced that the whole door mechanic in gameplay-terms is enhancing the experience.

@Madoc:
That's an interesting detail. I never had the problem opening/closing them by pressing the mouse but I know that mechanic from Amnesia. Are there any future plans to overhaul some of the door assets? The way the doors are designed currently just doesn't add up with the way they operate.

I can see the latch and I can definitely hear it the moment the door opens/closes. But how would you operate that latch that looks like it can only be operated by a key? So obviously the only other indicator how to use the door is this doorhandle that looks like it's only there to pull the door open. And even that thing is only on one side. (That's why I assumed that the doors can only be pushed or pulled).
It doesn't look like you would be able to operate that door ... But you can ... While the Zombies can't ... It just feels weird in a game that took all that effort to represent nearly realistic amour, weaponry, fighting and a really detailed environment that looks like people actually lived there at some time ...
Kudos to Exanima that it is so well crafted that those small visual design aspects even do stand out, but that's why I want to point that out. It just feels weird, especially when it allows easily for this really strange playstyle of luring the undead into rooms and close them in to secure your own passage ...
 

blobface

Insider
The same way you seem to be able to telepathically pick things up, move things around, or open doors... that is how the door latches are operated. I just accepted it as part of the game mechanism and its way of abstracting reality to simplify it. I can appreciate some things bother some people but not others, this would probably have to fall under that category, the sound feedback is plenty enough for me to understand that this is a door with a latch mechanism, I certainly wouldn't want to have to fiddle around with the actual door mechanism with every door I come across in game, I get to do that often in real life, I had to opened 4 doors today and it's not even 11am, I don't get to wield a sword to fight the undead in real life however, so I'd probably focus less on the former. That being said, I would certainly welcome additional details to the door mechanism as long as it doesn't make it tedious / slow it down.
 
That's an interesting detail. I never had the problem opening/closing them by pressing the mouse but I know that mechanic from Amnesia.
But you can ... While the Zombies can't ... It just feels weird in a game that took all that effort to represent nearly realistic amour, weaponry, fighting and a really detailed environment that looks like people actually lived there at some time ...
really strange playstyle of luring the undead into rooms and close them in to secure your own passage ...
Isn't this kinda like in Amnesia where you could just block their sight line and they wouldn't get to you? Or am I getting the completely wrong?
 
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@Madoc:
That's an interesting detail. I never had the problem opening/closing them by pressing the mouse but I know that mechanic from Amnesia.
But you can ... While the Zombies can't ... It just feels weird in a game that took all that effort to represent nearly realistic amour, weaponry, fighting and a really detailed environment that looks like people actually lived there at some time ...
really strange playstyle of luring the undead into rooms and close them in to secure your own passage ...
Isn't this kinda like in Amnesia where you could just block their sight line and they wouldn't get to you? Or am I getting the completely wrong?[/quote]
Honestly you have been given the answers multiple times but you still keep asking the same question over and over. The game does not have to represent everything realistically, we don't need turning door handles. The undead are said to be unable to open doors at least for now no npc can open doors. There may be a lore or design reason for this which is not fully apparent to us but people right now are running with what's currently supported. I hardly lock undead in rooms because they are very easy to kill if you become comfortable with your character and fighting from any angle. I easily maneuver around obstructions, I can fight with no armor confidently, and I do this all without locking undeads. It is your choice based on your capacity and what skills you will have to get through however you can.
 

K.L.R.G.

Member
@blobface
Wow, I am always surprised how fast people think somebody want to change the mechanics of their precious ... The only thing I am trying to find out now is, if they want to change a small little graphical detail in the future to make it more reasonable ... You know .. I have enough kitchens and toilets in my own house. I don't need this totally useless detail in my precious game! Nobody is living in this colony anyway. It's just a game. Make it the cliched, boring corridor full of monsters to wait in every room for me the hero to overcome them! That'll make this game really unique ... oh wait ...

@Orlacktherof :
I actually don't know ... The moment I found out that most enemys won't respawn after you died so that it wouldn't frustrate you, I gave up on that game. It's actually the opposite of Exanima that had a little bit to much tidious consequence for dying while Amnesia where I should be afraid of death didn't use any actual gamemechanic to enhance the atmosphere. The moment you start analysing any kind of mechanic in Amnesia it looses any kind of scaryness ... Not that I found it scary to begin with sadly ...

@Anthony Obilor :
But the "game of doors" became obviously a gameplay element by accident. If not for you, then for me and other players (I can't be the first who came up with that, because some people in the discussion already knew about this when I pointed that thing out). So why not remind the developers of that simple fact. It's their decision if they do anything with that and be it only to redesign some details on the doors to make it clearer.
From all I read (and saw ingame) the game trys to go the extra mile to be as authentic as possible. I don't see why I should just ignore details because some of it is already very authentic ... Especially in an Alpha-period where things are loose enough to change them ...
I won't argue about the everyburning torch for example because that makes sense from a gameplay-simplification. But the moment your door-mechanism allows a whole new way of playing the game you should make it clear (by redesigning the 3 or 4 types of door-assets the game has now) or keep it atleast in mind as a(n accidentally) gameplay-element ...
 

Greenbrog

Insider
The game intentionally requires a different approach for the first couple levels, over the rest. IT SAYS SO FROM THE DEVELOPERS the first time you open the game. It states that the beginning of the game is meant to be more about survival then combat, that you need to "gear" up before really attempting to fight things.

This "game of doors" is just one solution to this avoiding-combat-until-geared mechanic. You've really got to just get over it, and this includes people berating people about complaining about it. The game is dynamic, able to be solved with more than one play-style and this is only going to increase. This "game of doors" wasn't an accident, and it isn't the only play-style that's effective.

People are bitching now? Just wait until the rest of the skills are implemented and the learning curse includes 4 times as many things to do.

As for the doors. ALL things graphically, artistically, basically anything you see will have MORE. The developers just haven't gotten there, yet. Bitching about door knobs' artwork is tedious. The Devs have said more than once that there will be many many many tile sets and articles of clothing, eventually it will be almost exclusively what the Devs are working on, they just have a lot of other MECHANICAL things to work on.

Basically, you're bitching about crossing a river before the bridge is built, sure the supports are up and there is a rope to cross, but the bridge isn't meant to be crossed yet and it certainly can't handle rush hour traffic. Who cares what color the port-o-potties are during construction, they won't be there after it's finished.

@everyone that has more than 100 hours play, remember MOST people will probably NOT get very good at the combat. Claiming fighting almost anything is easy is not going to be the case for many, and these people will hit a skill wall when they hit it, so fighting things unarmored with crap weapons is simply ONE of the functional play-styles, just like "game of doors."

So, to many I say "go practice" at some others I say, "it's not done yet", at fewer I say "this game will never be for you", and fewer yet I say " congratulations and awesome." You know who you are. Just remember if you whine at everything and everyone, even if you like it, all people will hear is the whining.
 
What I am trying to get across is that the game is dangerous but not difficult yet with undead. Understanding a lot of the game is essential to being good at combat, the game makes positioning, spacial awareness, and understanding how physics affect your character very important. As soon as those fundamentals are down you find you can handle situations much easier. Using doors to lock undead is a very valid way to play, I myself have used it when I initially started. I was actually defending it's validity by saying there are many ways to play and much more skills and features are still yet to come. Probably my wording could have been better but I'm smoking.

Also using space only makes the campaign much more difficult than it needs to be, in arena it can work because of the space but then people find undead with limited skills that don't even block or parry difficult, why? Blame the unmoving chair for getting in ur way?
 
Isn't this kinda like in Amnesia where you could just block their sight line and they wouldn't get to you? Or am I getting the completely wrong?
Honestly you have been given the answers multiple times but you still keep asking the same question over and over. The game does not have to represent everything realistically, we don't need turning door handles. The undead are said to be unable to open doors at least for now no npc can open doors. There may be a lore or design reason for this which is not fully apparent to us but people right now are running with what's currently supported. I hardly lock undead in rooms because they are very easy to kill if you become comfortable with your character and fighting from any angle. I easily maneuver around obstructions, I can fight with no armor confidently, and I do this all without locking undeads. It is your choice based on your capacity and what skills you will have to get through however you can.
I was talking about Amnesia damnit...
Another thing, I already kill all the undead I see anyways...
 
I don't know how amnesia factored into how doors work in exanima, but madoc has stated above that there was a slight delay simulating opening a latch b4 the door can be pushed or pulled open, but players found this difficult. Which means they have tested it.

I understand @K.L.R.G, it's a small visual thing but iIalso agree that doors should have sort of visible ways to open it from both sides.
 
I don't know how amnesia factored into how doors work in exanima, but madoc has stated above that there was a slight delay simulating opening a latch b4 the door can be pushed or pulled open, but players found this difficult. Which means they have tested it.

I understand @K.L.R.G, it's a small visual thing but iIalso agree that doors should have sort of visible ways to open it from both sides.
I was mentioning about how in Amnesia(I think), the zombies would stop being aggressive once their line of sight was blocked, so perhaps the zombies in Exanima are similar where, once they can no longer see their target, they will stop trying to attack.

Edit: I think I went too far off topic
 

K.L.R.G.

Member
@Greenbrog :
I don't know how to word it better, but do you really think that the developers have every little detail they'll have to work on in their head yet? Do you think Madoc would have found out that the delay with the doors was unintuitive if not for anybody who "whined" about it?
There is no whining anywhere and there is no bridge yet, but when the bridge is build they hopefully have a nice and useful list of things people "whined" about that they can check to see how to advance their bridge ... As if they can't use any detailed feedback yet ...
They probably already have a long list of ideas, misconceptions and small details that came up in all kinds of discussions here that they'll check when the time is right for it. That's what early access like this should be all about ...

@Anthony Obilor :
If I break it down I don't see that many different ways to play it. Which hopefully will change with advanced skill-systems. But currently there is mastering the melee (which I am still 80+ hours away from), using the door-tricks or sneaking and avoiding with the risk of enemys falling into your back. I haven't found any way to use the physics yet because barricading the doors has no use yet (aside from the trap-corridore) and trying to through stuff in the enemys way seems only effective when you are good enough to fight them unharmed anyway, because you have to manage the movement and interacting at the same time ...
That's why I would prefer the Undead being able to open doors ... Then it would be more incalculable and barricading doors would be a usefull tactic that involves the physics ... Well, I keep hoping for the next update ...

@Orlacktherof : It can't be site, because I remember them hunting me for a longer period. Once they hunt me only doors seem to stop them ... And even than they need a minute ...
 
@Orlacktherof : It can't be site, because I remember them hunting me for a longer period. Once they hunt me only doors seem to stop them ... And even than they need a minute ...
They have varying levels of aggression and other things. Some will eventually get bored of chasing, some will not even care what you do to them until you hit them, and some will stop trying to fight you if you don't interact with them for enough time.
 

ZaratanCho

Insider
The zombies cant open doors, nothing so strange about it. Makes the zombies perfect for the very beginning of the game which the first 3 levels are, not a complete game. Not sure what all the fuss is about. Other npcs like the skeletons will be able to open doors and even sense you through walls. Matter of lore and it also adds variety.
 
I don't have any streaming capabilities, unless beam is very easy to setup, but I can use Skype to stream if anyone wants some tips and guides for how I handle my character and the campaign. Lemme know and IL try to have a look at beam. I use sword and shield mainly.
 
I don't have any streaming capabilities, unless beam is very easy to setup, but I can use Skype to stream if anyone wants some tips and guides for how I handle my character and the campaign. Lemme know and IL try to have a look at beam. I use sword and shield mainly.
Doesn't steam have the option to broadcast? or do you not have steam?
 
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